Just doing some research...

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[StillAGCMer]

I currently attend a GCM church. (My particular church started as a campus ministry and grew to a community church.)  I'm still attending college and have been in the church for just about two years.. When I first started I was simply a member, but now I've gotten into some leadership--mostly informal although I'm taking over a life group in a few weeks. 

Anyway-- I went home this weekend and my father revealed to me that he thinks I'm in a cult.  It's not the first time I'd heard this.  The woman who is discipling me had told me her parents thought the same thing while she was going through college and at Faithwalkers 2011 Tom Short had mentioned his family thinking it too.  But MY family thinking it? It was just too weird.  I talked to my boyfriend about it (he used to be a member of my church, but moved away and got a 'real' job after graduating college) and he said that it was in fact labelled a cult at one time... I started researching it and eventually made it to this site.

I guess the point of this post is that I'm partially in complete disagreement with what I've read... and partially I'm afraid that I disagree with what is being said because I'm too deep into it... I guess I'm looking for some advice? If you guys have any...

But I also just want to say that I think my church (or the campus side anyway, because that's what I know..) is a bit different from most of the GCM churches.  I'm a very outspoken individual, so when I don't agree with something I let my campus minister know (in private) and I've never been rebuked or chastised for it.  He usually explains what he and the church thinks, but if I still don't agree at the end we usually agree to disagree.  There has been some staff movement in the past year or so and when the new staff came in, I had a situation more along the lines of what I've read here, where I was asked to quit my job in order to better devote myself to God while in college... I didn't agree and had some words with the leader about it. He told me I wasn't trusting God enough to bless me financially and I told him that He did.. by giving me a job. I let my campus minister know about the conversation and he also had some words with the new guy and he backed down and apologized... So maybe that will give you some hope for the leadership in GCM? I don't know... Do you guys have any thoughts?

I'm sorry for the rambling... I'm just a little freaked out that I may be blinded...

[Linda]

Anyway-- I went home this weekend and my father revealed to me that he thinks I'm in a cult.  It's not the first time I'd heard this.  The woman who is discipling me had told me her parents thought the same thing while she was going through college and at Faithwalkers 2011 Tom Short had mentioned his family thinking it too.  But MY family thinking it? It was just too weird.  I talked to my boyfriend about it (he used to be a member of my church, but moved away and got a 'real' job after graduating college) and he said that it was in fact labelled a cult at one time... I started researching it and eventually made it to this site.

Welcome.

I am sorry you are finding yourself in this position. I totally relate to your last sentence. "I am just a little freaked out that I might be blinded..."

I remember well the sinking, nauseating, heart racing feeling I had when I googled "Great Commission Churches cults" and lots of results popped up. Of course, I didn't randomly Google those words, things seemed off (the Holy Spirit) and after enough red flags, my husband and I started doing research. We were in GC for 10 years.

The difficulty in leaving is that they did a lot right. It's just that the things they did wrong were very, very wrong. They were game changers for us. Two things in particular were our reasons for leaving. Commitment for life (to the local church) and obedience to elders ("giving the controls of your life to the men God works through"). No matter how you try to explain it, there is no mediator between us and Christ and when an elder says you should give the controls of your life to your elders and commit for life to the group, they have crossed a line.

Realizing that I know nothing about your personal experience, I would encourage you to keep the conversation going with your dad. He has known you all your life and loves you in a way that no GC leader could. It might be good to take a little time away from the group (go home for more weekends, for example) and get some perspective--especially if you feel GC leaders are trying to influence your educational and career path. This is not something a pastor has any more right to do than a good friend. They don't have a more special connection to the Lord and if they say they do, run. Fast.

It is good that you love the Lord and care about people coming to know him and grow in their faith. I pray that the Holy Spirit will guide you on this journey. The good news is that the Lord will lead you and you don't need to be freaked out.

God bless you.

[Unknowntoall4ever]

I don't know your church.  I don't know you.  I don't know this new staff member.

But it sounds like you and they have handled things excellently over the years.  Despite having disagreements and not doing what this new staff member asked, they're comfortable with you leading.

You've lovingly made known disagreements with them and they've listened.  "Unity in the essentials, liberty in the non-essentials, and charity in all things" is a policy in most non-denominational churches and seems to be like it's one that's operating here. Speaking to someone on the level of a friend is quite different from speaking to them as a leader and the best leaders seem to be those who can speak clearly on both levels while not confusing them.  Sounds like your new staff member is learning to do this or needs to learn to do this.

I don't know you're particular church situation but I would encourage your parents to talk to your pastor.  Keep the dialogue flowing between them and you and your pastor and evaluate it all in the light of God's Word.

There is nothing theologically that would make a church in GCM or GCC a cult.  It has been labeled as "aberrant" in the past and by some in the present (many of whom will be responding here).  In all reality these GC churches are organizationally autonomous and require you to evaluate your church on the basis of the character and lives of the leaders in your particular church.  That's not something I, or anyone else here can speak to.

Here's something I found, should you ever need it.  There is a formal process for those with a concern that can be found at http://www.gccweb.org/about/faq/##16.  I think GCM would follow something pretty similar.

I can acknowledge this is a trying time in your life right now.  I will be praying for you for wisdom and discernment and that the peace of the Holy Spirit would guard your heart and mind. I will also be praying you would be free from worry and anxiety over this and that it won't detract you from our wonderful calling to being a witness to those around us about Jesus Christ and His gospel.

[Linda]

One more thing. While I'm not against talking with GC leaders, my personal experience (which did involve speaking with men on the national board) was that information was withheld from me. In good faith, I thought they were being straight with me, and as it turns out, I was misled by what they didn't say. (One even denied that the error statement was and error statement.)

Did your dad tell you his concerns? I would encourage you to talk more with him about them. Also, I would encourage you to listen to Faithwalkers talks done by men on the national board over the past few years. (Maybe even discuss them with your dad.) Listening to their teaching will give you a better idea about what they believe and where they are headed. Messages on commitment, loyalty, and unity are especially telling.

[EverAStudent]

Greetings, and welcome to the forum, stillagcmer!

First and foremost, your relationship to Christ is the priority.  Church affiliations are secondary to your fellowship with Christ.  Church affiliations change with life flow and with ministry flow.  One day Paul is ministering at Ephesus and the next he is on the mission trail with Barnabas, then he is parted from Barnabas and is on the road with Luke and others.  Affiliations are not what you live and die for, Christ is.

Numerous threads on this forum discuss the improper doctrines and theology of GC.  Review those threads (do a search for "bad theology" and similar phrases) and then compare what you read with your own church's theology and doctine.  This will give you a basis for making informed decisions (if your church has bad doctrine you may decide to seek another, if your church has pristine doctrine then why leave?).  

As Linda would be willing to point out, one of the most blatant false doctrines that pervades many GC churches is: "you must join GC for life or you will only experience God's second best."  This false doctrine continually surfaces at leadership training and at Faithwalkers.  Hopefully your pastors have rejected this damaging falsehood.

Blessings and welcome.

[AgathaL'Orange]

But I also just want to say that I think my church (or the campus side anyway, because that's what I know..) is a bit different from most of the GCM churches.  I'm a very outspoken individual, so when I don't agree with something I let my campus minister know (in private) and I've never been rebuked or chastised for it.  He usually explains what he and the church thinks, but if I still don't agree at the end we usually agree to disagree.  There has been some staff movement in the past year or so and when the new staff came in, I had a situation more along the lines of what I've read here, where I was asked to quit my job in order to better devote myself to God while in college... I didn't agree and had some words with the leader about it. He told me I wasn't trusting God enough to bless me financially and I told him that He did.. by giving me a job. I let my campus minister know about the conversation and he also had some words with the new guy and he backed down and apologized... So maybe that will give you some hope for the leadership in GCM? I don't know... Do you guys have any thoughts?

I'm sorry for the rambling... I'm just a little freaked out that I may be blinded...

For me this might be a red flag as I have never in any other Christian organization (and I've been in many, many, many since birth) suggest that I quit my job or anything of the like.  Ever.  So, to me, the fact that a leader would feel that would be appropriate is not a good sign!  He most likely has been told that at one point, or has heard it taught to someone else.  I've simply never had anyone else try to control me like that outside of GC. 

I understand your trepidation at this point.  I had it too.  It took me years to act on it.  I think it's neat that your dad cares and took the time to research something you are involved in.  There must have been some warning signs for him to do that, or does he usually think you are involved with harmful things?

Welcome, I hope we don't scare you off! 

Happily GC-free,
Agatha

[AgathaL'Orange]

Also, it has been my observation that "leadership" in GC is quite complex (well, not really, there are actually only a FEW real bosses).  It is often used as a nice ego stroke to keep people coming and perpetuating the whole deal.  Kind of like a Christian pyramid scheme.  They have to keep "promoting" people to keep them feeling okay about all the time spent, etc. 

My goodness, we were made "leaders" about 3 months after we joined and we weren't even official members yet.  Then again, we had no authority.  LOL.  There are "leaders" who have given everything for GC and still aren't at a leadership level that a son of a "real leader" pastor will achieve.  There are guys who worked full time at a job or near full time and then led the local church with preaching, small groups, service, etc and the church could never find the money for them to be full time.  But, a son of a pastor?  He is given his own church at a young 20-something.  Look around, ask questions, you might be surprised.

[Neverbeengcm]

StillAGCMer,

I am sorry to hear about your personal struggles with your church. It has been my experience that the Great Commission does not encourage free thinking people, like yourself, to express their thoughts or intelligently discuss alternative views regarding almost anything in life. If you don't agree with the church's views or doctrine, perhaps another church home would be a better fit for you.  I hope you are able to make a decision on your church home that allows you to feel free to express your faith in ways that are meaningful and important to you.

I don't think that a person should feel any pressure from your church regarding where to work or other personal decisions. Life is too short to spend trying to please our church or the church leaders. Blaming your trust in God for not becoming wealthy is a very strange way of thinking to me.  If we all gathered wealth based on how much we trusted in God, most of the rich people I know would not be rich and a lot of the people I know with very little in the way of financial wealth would be much richer. We can't blame/credit everything that happens on God or satan.  We all have the power to make our own decisions using intelligence and integrity.   

I pray that you are able to do what you feel is in your heart and in the best interest of your long-term emotional health.

God Bless
 

[Janet Easson Martin]

Dear StillAGCMer,

God's Word says you are wise to research any church.  To hold it up next to the Word of God to see if it matches.  The problem I had when I was in your shoes was that scripture had been inaccurately interpreted and narrowly applied for me.  It was qualified to me in such a way as to modify or limit the bible's meaning, scope, and strength.  (Prior to GCx I was only vaguely familiar with the Bible, and so I ate up everything I was taught in GCx as the correct interpretation of it.)

The only way for me to measure it then was to go outside GCx to look at other Believing Churches and check other books written by good christian authors on the interpretation and application of God's Word.  Of course, at that time, we were told it would be poisonous and REBELLIOUS to us to do such a thing.  Now, I know that the truth of the Bible tells us to RUN from such persuasion.   I finally mustered up the courage to read what other christians in the body of Christ were saying, outside the walls of GCx.  In secret, I read with much angst, the Grace Awakening by Chuck Swindoll. And later,Toxic Faith by Stephen Arterburn, and other books I listed under THE BOOK LIST in the Healing Topic section of this forum.  

One interesting thing was that most of the 10 different people or so at that time who said this group (GCx) had toxic (or cultlike) characteristics were CHRISTIANS.  They had no selfish interest in which church I went to, but their interest was in ME.  Kind of like an honest friend who may warn you that your boyfriend seems abusive or is abusive.  If you NEED it to be true that he is not abusive, then you will turn a deaf ear to their suspicion or warning.  So, ask yourself this question:

Do you need it to be true that GCx is not a church or organization with false teaching or toxic characteristics?  

If the answer is yes, ask our compassionate Saviour to remove the blindfold from your eyes, and supernaturally help you to see and accept any truth he wants to show you.  He will not turn away any sincere request in faith.  He will never forsake you.  He himself will give you divine comfort and peace and you will know Him even better!  

"For the Lord will surely comfort Zion and have compassion on all her ruins.  He will make her deserts like Eden.  Her wastelands like the gardens of the Lord."           _{Isaiah 51:3}

The Bible says in Galatians that other people who are zealously friendly and smotheringly persuasive toward you in regard to joining with their "christian" group or church are NOT interested in You and your spiritual welfare - they are very interested in your participation in their concoction of a "church" FOLLOWING, which turns out actually to be an isolation from nearly all that is healthy in the body of Christ; and eventually robs you of your very freedom and faith.  Read Galatians, especially chapters 1,3,&5 to see how that happened to some of the Galatian christians.  These are believers Paul is addressing.

Don't wait 10 years like I did to have the courage to face the truth and DEPEND on your extemely faithful and sympathetic Saviour through His WORD.  Don't fall into the trap of PLEASING MEN.  Pray and ask God to give you wisdom from above that gives you much PEACE.  I will pray for a supernatural revelation from God himself through His Word to you, a Word so astoundingly personal to your questions and confusion it could only be God.  He will not disappoint those who WAIT for Him.

Very Sympathetic and Understanding of Your Quandry,

Janet

[blonde]

I do agree that many in the leadership role either locally or nationally is toxic, so I do agree with Janet. 

May I ask StillAGCMer, why is it so important to stay in such a movement? 

-Blonde