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Author Topic: Letter from John Hopler  (Read 35964 times)
Linda
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« Reply #20 on: March 25, 2013, 10:40:54 am »

2XA Ron,

It is not like Hopler and others are unaware of our concerns over their commitment teaching and sectarian nature. We have presented them as clearly as we could in person numerous times to pastors and members of the top decision making body of GC, and, after that, on this forum.

I have come to the conclusion that the problems with GC teaching are discernment ones and no amount of reasoning can change their view. They truly believe they are in the right and posters on this forum are the enemy. The Holy Spirit must intervene.

That said, if you feel prompted by the Holy Spirit to communicate with members of the national board, you should do so.
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Linda
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« Reply #21 on: March 25, 2013, 11:39:24 am »

So these came to Philip, who was from Bethsaida in Galilee, and asked him, “Sir, we wish to see Jesus.” John 12:21

Something I've been thinking about regarding GC (and many other churches). The message I have for all pastors. The "open letter" to all pastors. When people attend your churches, do they leave "seeing Jesus", or, do they see YOU, the pastor? Or, YOUR CHURCH?

Do they leave sensing they need to be more committed to their church? Or to Jesus?

Do they leave sensing they need to obey the pastor? Or, Jesus?

In a healthy church, people leave thinking about Jesus.


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Huldah
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« Reply #22 on: March 25, 2013, 02:38:38 pm »

Linda's questions in the last post raise yet another question. Would it be fair to say that the major sin of the GC leadership (and the sin of people like me who gave them control of our lives for a time) is idolatry? When we give anything the loyalty that God alone should hold, that's idolatry. It's a strong word, but I think it fits. Comments, opinions?
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Linda
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« Reply #23 on: March 25, 2013, 03:42:56 pm »

Huldah, I don't think that's strong at all. When you put something where only God should be, you have created an idol.

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This was the single most important decision I made and have continued to make. I have surrendered my will, not only to God, but I have surrendered it to this movement called Great Commission Churches. I've surrendered to John Hopler. to Rick Whitney. To Tom Short who I work with. I've surrendered it to Hershel Martindale. I've surrendered it to Brent Knox.

You don't say things like, "I have surrendered my will to God AND..." If you do, whatever is after the "and" is your idol.

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EverAStudent
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« Reply #24 on: March 26, 2013, 07:35:38 am »

I think the charge of idolatry in this specific instance is too much.  We all surrender our wills to others because God commanded it.  Slaves surrender their wills to their masters' wills...and God commanded them to do so.  Husbands and wives submit their wills to their mates' wills...and commanded them to do so.

Surrendering one's will is the volitional act of doing what someone else wants even if emotionally or intellectually we would not ordinarily do on our own what the other person wants us to do.  We might not obey traffic laws on our own, but we surrender that will to the government because God commanded us to obey our governments.  We might not feel like being intimate one night, but our spouse wants this so we surrender our will to our spouse.

In church we surrender our wills to the sermons preached by our pastors.  We allow ourselves to be persuaded of the intepretations they present.  Jesus told the Jews to obey the words of the rabbis because they were seated in the chair of Moses, though He cautioned the Jews not to follow their behavior, just their teachings.  That is a surrender of wills to a teacher.

Surrendering our wills does not mean turning off our brains.  If a pastor cannot persuade because his interpretation is demonstrably wrong, then we do not surrender to poor scholarship, ignorance, or nonsense.

GC's sin, as far as I observed, was that the pastors issued commands that they were NOT authorized by Scriptures to issue.  They wanted their whims obeyed like mini-monarchs and exiled those persons who would not be subject to these self-annointed kings.  They wanted lifetime personal commitments they had no right to ask for.  They offered unsound teachings to justify their actions and their overlord positions. 

Surrendering one's will to a God-commanded authority for God-commanded purposes is not idolatry.  But abuse of position is surely the sin of lording it over others and I think that abuse of authority is GC's principle sin.

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Linda
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« Reply #25 on: March 26, 2013, 07:52:20 am »

I think we are equivocating on the term "will" or "control".
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pvitartas
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« Reply #26 on: July 13, 2013, 08:04:45 pm »

In the 70's in Solid Rock, things were kept in house as much as possible.  I recall an expose written in the Ohio State University Newspaper, the Lantern, in which a Solid Rock spokesman downright lied.  He stated that "disciples" were not encouraged to drop out of college by members of then, Solid Rock.  I assure you, from personal experience, that is/was a lie.  I lost two years of college time because of these idiots, and my being gullible.

It really doesn't look like the self righteous have changed - the movement has simply taken on an older, more mature, public relations face.

I really do fear harrassment by these people simply for being critical.   
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Huldah
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« Reply #27 on: July 14, 2013, 08:42:42 pm »

Welcome to the forum, Pvitartas. I was "officially" at Solid Rock from Fall Qtr '77 through Winter '78, though my informal association with them had started well before that. Who knows, maybe we crossed paths there a time or two.

The pressure to drop out of school and "serve the Lord full time" was intense. Even though I, personally, was counseled by an elder to stay in school (since my parents were adamant about that), there were a few brothers and sisters within my immediate circle who seemed uncomfortable with my staying in school, and some (one sister in particular) who undermined my study time in various ways.

I also remember one college classmate (an unbeliever) who had a sister in Solid Rock. When he found out I was a member, his first reaction was to ask me to persuade his sister to resume her education.

They definitely encouraged dropping out. They used to say that being career-oriented was a waste, because, "If God wants a doctor, he'll save a doctor. If he wants a lawyer, he'll save a lawyer." I never saw the Lantern article you mentioned, though. Maybe it was published after I left Columbus.
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Linda
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« Reply #28 on: September 24, 2016, 12:29:51 pm »

I found this old thread interesting. Thought I'd post and "reopen" it in case others might want to read it.
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Janet Easson Martin
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« Reply #29 on: September 24, 2016, 06:53:27 pm »

I agree with you, Linda. It does appear by their actions over the last 25 years that the leadership of GCx is not actually interested in repenting from their vast spiritual abuse against their members.  So, their unwillingness makes any further discussion with them of no value.  They may claim to be apologetic and  created a so-called 'official apology' by writing the "Weaknesses Paper" in 1991, but this was all SMOKE & MIRRORS.  Many who did receive it felt offended as it was quite insincere and grossly underrated the harm done to them.  The 'apology' NEVER made it out to most of the people affected by GCx's toxic "faith teachings".  And, as you highlighted, some were denied access to the paper even if they requested it.  It seemed to be more of PR stunt to pretend that all of the public criticism against them was no longer valid.  

Well now, a quarter of a century after it's "claim" is more than enough time to conclude that GCx has rejected it's members' pleas to end it's False teaching and longstanding spiritual abuse.  They are not willing to oust the ungodly false teaching of it's founder, Jim McCotter.  So the question in the past as to whether they will change has been answered. The important question now appears to be, "When will they be shut down?"  

I believe they will definitely be blown away like chaff; like a lonely flagstaff on a desolate hill.  God is faithfully doing his threshing work there.

« Last Edit: September 26, 2016, 11:50:35 am by Janet Easson Martin » Logged

For grace is given not because we have done good works, but in order that we may be able to do them.        - Saint Augustine
Janet Easson Martin
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« Reply #30 on: September 26, 2016, 07:02:40 am »

Here is a passage of scripture God gave me several years ago that I felt in my spirit spoke of the fault and demise of GCx:


"These are rebellious people, deceitful children,
children unwilling to listen to the Lord's instruction

They say to the seers...

Leave this way, get off this path,
and stop confronting us with the Holy One of Israel!

Therefore, this is what the Holy One of Israel says:

Because you have rejected this message, relied on oppression and depended on deceit,
this sin will become for you like a high wall, cracked and bulging, that collapses suddenly in an instant...

A thousand will flee at the threat of one; at the threat of five you will all flee away,
til you are left like a flagstaff on a mountaintop"


Isaiah 30:9,10,11-13,17
(Underlining mine)


« Last Edit: September 26, 2016, 11:51:46 am by Janet Easson Martin » Logged

For grace is given not because we have done good works, but in order that we may be able to do them.        - Saint Augustine
margaret
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« Reply #31 on: March 25, 2017, 04:19:33 am »

Seems like Hopler is far less interested in this site since he "reconciled" with Larry Pile. And by "reconciled," I mean controlled any "damage" by Pile's reports.
I think Hopler was more affected by Pile's influence than the forum's.

Thoughts?
« Last Edit: March 25, 2017, 08:39:55 am by margaret » Logged
pvitartas
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« Reply #32 on: March 18, 2018, 02:49:34 am »

I recently put out feelers to acquaintances from then, "Solid Rock."  As far as any contact or reconciliation is concerned, it's on you, not them.  In the 70's, if you weren't "on fire for the Lord" according to the groups parameters, you weren't a priority...and so I believe it remains. 

I have given considerable thought to John's letter.  The connotative tenor of the letter is - John will talk, if you go to him - he will not seek you, and neither will anyone else from the movement for that matter.

In my opinion, prioritizing people depending on their commitment to Christ (really - commitment to the group) is the subtle, most un Christlike aspect of The Great Commission Church in general.  In that regard, the movement dehumanizes. 
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pvitartas
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« Reply #33 on: June 18, 2022, 02:40:02 pm »

To add to my previous post - I was initially thrilled upon reading Hopler's letter - I reached out to old friends still in the cult hoping things had REALLY changed.  Most I didn't hear from.  I did hear from two people; it occurred to me that they were possibly "assigned" to communicate with me.  LOL
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