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Author Topic: Rock BOT - or "Why is Mark Darling's best friend able to decide he's innocent?  (Read 21808 times)
Greentruth
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« Reply #40 on: May 23, 2018, 07:54:14 am »

GTA, This forum is at a level of hostility I have yet to see, and it appears to be a last effort to manipulate in anyway possible.  It’s actually scary.

As for my association with ECC members and my current Church there is no difference, other than I miss my brothers and sisters at ECC. A couple of leaders from my current church are aware of this situation and this forum, and are praying for those unjustly attacked. I’m always in contact with several friends at ECC who are heartbroken, and have prayed with them. We look for the good thatGod will use this for. Who knows, maybe even a few hearts from this forum will be softened, and finally find peace and separation from this forum. I pray for all involved, but this forum has gone off the charts in hostility.
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Rypick
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« Reply #41 on: May 23, 2018, 07:55:07 am »

I'm pretty sure his innocence would've been questioned no matter what, because of this forum's biases.
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Rebel in a Good Way
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« Reply #42 on: May 23, 2018, 07:57:58 am »

You and ISR (and perhaps others, I haven't gone back to look) have mentioned Tom's homosexuality.  What does that have to do with his news reporting?  Why should his being homosexual cast any doubt on his ability to tell the truth?  Or being an atheist for that matter?  Often times Christian "other" people to marginalize them (well, humans do that in general but Jesus showed very specifically through his life that we are not to do this).  The fact that you have included those characteristics while questioning his ability to report truthfully means that you find them contrary to honest character.  Or else why mention them at all?  Do either of you have a good reason to mention them?  Christians do not have a great reputation for being loving toward GLBT people.  So the onus is on you as to how you speak about members of that community.  

Your #6 is what is concerning to me as far as his credibility. That and that alone would give me pause to consider his ethics.  



 hum

Quote from: GTA
He also has very personal bias against the church, as an atheist.  This is the guy that will shine some light on the situation?




  I want to add that this perspective that people outside of Evergreen do not know what is true or just is a symptom of the sickness that is Evergreen and all of its affiliates.

 Ahh, nope.  I have mentioned on here before, I have very close friends, many actually,  from different churches and denominations across the cities.  I have shared here before how beautiful it is that we speak the same language...bible believing Christians all over the world speak the same language, even across cultures, and that bond we have with other believers is such a gift of the holy spirit.  I bet Greentruth will have the same experiences to share as well.  I don't know who Greentruth is, but I know he has done a lot of ministry, and 3rd world missions.  Greentruth, can you speak to this as well??

Could it possibly be that your perspective of ECC churches is what is unhealthy?   At this point in my life I should have a terribly unhealthy view and perspective, being in ECC churches for 20 years.  I should have great difficulty in being in relationship with believers outside of ECC, or valuing them. 

And again, another grand speculation that ECC folks are all incredibly unhealthy individuals, and that we are unable to decipher truth as part of our sickness.
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Shamednomore
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« Reply #43 on: May 23, 2018, 08:55:21 am »

By your argument, Todd Goodwinn, who will be involved in the outcome of the "investigation" and how it is released or not, would find it difficult to be unbiased, especially since it is personal to him....Your own words


You and ISR (and perhaps others, I haven't gone back to look) have mentioned Tom's homosexuality.  What does that have to do with his news reporting?  Why should his being homosexual cast any doubt on his ability to tell the truth?  Or being an atheist for that matter?  Often times Christian "other" people to marginalize them (well, humans do that in general but Jesus showed very specifically through his life that we are not to do this).  The fact that you have included those characteristics while questioning his ability to report truthfully means that you find them contrary to honest character.  Or else why mention them at all?  Do either of you have a good reason to mention them?  Christians do not have a great reputation for being loving toward GLBT people.  So the onus is on you as to how you speak about members of that community.  

Your #6 is what is concerning to me as far as his credibility. That and that alone would give me pause to consider his ethics.  



 hum

Quote from: GTA
He also has very personal bias against the church, as an atheist.  This is the guy that will shine some light on the situation?




  I want to add that this perspective that people outside of Evergreen do not know what is true or just is a symptom of the sickness that is Evergreen and all of its affiliates.

 Ahh, nope.  I have mentioned on here before, I have very close friends, many actually,  from different churches and denominations across the cities.  I have shared here before how beautiful it is that we speak the same language...bible believing Christians all over the world speak the same language, even across cultures, and that bond we have with other believers is such a gift of the holy spirit.  I bet Greentruth will have the same experiences to share as well.  I don't know who Greentruth is, but I know he has done a lot of ministry, and 3rd world missions.  Greentruth, can you speak to this as well??

Could it possibly be that your perspective of ECC churches is what is unhealthy?   At this point in my life I should have a terribly unhealthy view and perspective, being in ECC churches for 20 years.  I should have great difficulty in being in relationship with believers outside of ECC, or valuing them. 

And again, another grand speculation that ECC folks are all incredibly unhealthy individuals, and that we are unable to decipher truth as part of our sickness.

Because of bias.  I have an atheist family member, and I am very well aware of her bias towards the church, and her near seething opinions and comments.  I also know gay people that have a strong bias against the church, well because of many churches strong stance against homosexuality and poor compassion, and then the media tends to highlight the crazies that show up to events with their signs claiming damnation for all gays, and then that seems to be the representation of all Christians towards gays.  But anyways, because this is a "story" about a church, there is the possibility of some objectivity issues that are obvious.  Who knows, maybe he has the ability to be completely objective and unbiased, but I doubt this, as a human this is difficult, especially when it is personal.   And I am sure he has every ability to tell the truth, and do good.  He has done good for people.  But I question his ability to be objective in considering how a story against a church might hit close to home for him, or being emotionally charged, and also how he tends to have a greater percentage of "big" stories that are focused on the wrong doing's of people within churches. 

Please stop trying to paint me in this light.  It is inaccurate and sad.  Mark Bowen had a message, at least 20+ years old, (and sadly it is not in the digital library of messages) that gave me a great compassion and love for LGBT people, and a soft heart and understanding.  I had actually shared this message with others, and family members, when it was on tape I felt it to be so powerful.  I had an older Christian relative that had hired a young gay man and was honestly struggling a bit, so I had him listen to the message to help him have a tender heart towards this young man.  So I guess those are the actions or example of a person that is unable to love and embrace LGBT people?  I don't know, I guess the onus to prove my stance would be difficult on this forum, especially because you do not know me. 
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Rebel in a Good Way
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« Reply #44 on: May 23, 2018, 08:59:09 am »

I would suggest that, for starters, you don't create a list of why someone is untrustworthy and have their homosexuality included as the top 2 items.  How should one interpret that?  You don't get to say "I love gay people and how dare you say I don't" and "you can't trust them because of their bias."

You don't like it when all ECC people are lumped together. You don't like it when the obvious conflicts of interests with the BOT are pointed out because you take it as an accusation against their character.  But here you lump together all gay people as having a conflict of interest against the church that would prevent them from doing their job truthfully.  

I don't think you're a bad or unloving person. I believe you care about the gay people that you know.  I don't think you realize what is reflected in your words.

You and ISR (and perhaps others, I haven't gone back to look) have mentioned Tom's homosexuality.  What does that have to do with his news reporting?  Why should his being homosexual cast any doubt on his ability to tell the truth?  Or being an atheist for that matter?  Often times Christian "other" people to marginalize them (well, humans do that in general but Jesus showed very specifically through his life that we are not to do this).  The fact that you have included those characteristics while questioning his ability to report truthfully means that you find them contrary to honest character.  Or else why mention them at all?  Do either of you have a good reason to mention them?  Christians do not have a great reputation for being loving toward GLBT people.  So the onus is on you as to how you speak about members of that community.  

Your #6 is what is concerning to me as far as his credibility. That and that alone would give me pause to consider his ethics.  



 hum

Quote from: GTA
He also has very personal bias against the church, as an atheist.  This is the guy that will shine some light on the situation?




  I want to add that this perspective that people outside of Evergreen do not know what is true or just is a symptom of the sickness that is Evergreen and all of its affiliates.

 Ahh, nope.  I have mentioned on here before, I have very close friends, many actually,  from different churches and denominations across the cities.  I have shared here before how beautiful it is that we speak the same language...bible believing Christians all over the world speak the same language, even across cultures, and that bond we have with other believers is such a gift of the holy spirit.  I bet Greentruth will have the same experiences to share as well.  I don't know who Greentruth is, but I know he has done a lot of ministry, and 3rd world missions.  Greentruth, can you speak to this as well??

Could it possibly be that your perspective of ECC churches is what is unhealthy?   At this point in my life I should have a terribly unhealthy view and perspective, being in ECC churches for 20 years.  I should have great difficulty in being in relationship with believers outside of ECC, or valuing them. 

And again, another grand speculation that ECC folks are all incredibly unhealthy individuals, and that we are unable to decipher truth as part of our sickness.

Because of bias.  I have an atheist family member, and I am very well aware of her bias towards the church, and her near seething opinions and comments.  I also know gay people that have a strong bias against the church, well because of many churches strong stance against homosexuality and poor compassion, and then the media tends to highlight the crazies that show up to events with their signs claiming damnation for all gays, and then that seems to be the representation of all Christians towards gays.  But anyways, because this is a "story" about a church, there is the possibility of some objectivity issues that are obvious.  Who knows, maybe he has the ability to be completely objective and unbiased, but I doubt this, as a human this is difficult, especially when it is personal.   And I am sure he has every ability to tell the truth, and do good.  He has done good for people.  But I question his ability to be objective in considering how a story against a church might hit close to home for him, or being emotionally charged, and also how he tends to have a greater percentage of "big" stories that are focused on the wrong doing's of people within churches. 

Please stop trying to paint me in this light.  It is inaccurate and sad.  Mark Bowen had a message, at least 20+ years old, (and sadly it is not in the digital library of messages) that gave me a great compassion and love for LGBT people, and a soft heart and understanding.  I had actually shared this message with others, and family members, when it was on tape I felt it to be so powerful.  I had an older Christian relative that had hired a young gay man and was honestly struggling a bit, so I had him listen to the message to help him have a tender heart towards this young man.  So I guess those are the actions or example of a person that is unable to love and embrace LGBT people?  I don't know, I guess the onus to prove my stance would be difficult on this forum, especially because you do not know me. 
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Rebel in a Good Way
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« Reply #45 on: May 23, 2018, 09:08:07 am »

GTA, looking over the list I wrote and now hearing your explanation, I was unfair.  I apologize.  I can add an edit to my original posts if that would make any amends.

However, I still disagree with your assertions.
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Greentruth
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« Reply #46 on: May 23, 2018, 09:12:12 am »

Rebel, I think you know the hurt that comes from your comments at times, and it doesn’t bother you, as you stated recently

I have family and friends who are lgbt, and we get along great. I treat them like anyone else, other than gaurding how I interact. My cousin who struggles her lgbt identity has come to me a few times with questions, and I answer with Biblical truth as loving as possible

I volunteered at an aids fun raiser through my Church in a bike ride across the country. I was checking in and tagging bikes, and two gay men asked why I was helping, when they found outI was from a Church they became very angry and verbally attacked me until I walked away. It goes both ways, and as a Christian I always try and be a light and not judge. As I told my cousin, it’s not my job to judge, as I just try and share truth as loving as possible when I see anyone purposely trying to hurt someone else I speak out, from either side, just as I speak out at the hurt being dished out here
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