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Author Topic: Evergreen Experience (Part I)  (Read 18494 times)
Lisa1863
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« on: March 13, 2018, 08:04:44 am »

Hello - This is my first time posting to the forum, but I feel compelled to share my experience at Evergreen Community Church.  This experience has affected my life tremendously, and though it has been over 15 years since I left the church, the years of spiritual abuse I was subject to, changed who I was as a person and stripped me of my faith.

I first starting going to EC around 1993.  I was raised Lutheran, but stopped going to church after being confirmed at age 15.  I had always been skeptical in my beliefs and by the time I graduated for law school in 1992, I considered myself an Atheist.  I suffered from clinical depression most of my life, and was dealing with a particularly difficult time.  I started seeing a therapist and began to deal with the sexual assaults I had suffered over the course of my lifetime.  I was also diagnosed with Post-traumatic Stress Disorder.  I had always dealt with trust issues and isolation which had gotten much worse.  I also was waffling with my faith in God.  My therapist suggested I seek out a church setting to help me with overcoming some of my issues.  I believe she referred to it as a "safe place to learn how to trust people."  I had a friend who attended EC and she brought me to a service in Bloomington.  I was encouraged by the nature of the service (very unlike my prior church experiences) and intrigued by the teachings.  Bible interpretation had always interested me and I wanted to find out more about EC.  I attended several more sessions and was impressed by how welcoming everyone seemed to be.

I decided to seek some counseling with one of the pastors and was directed to a particular person (I am not going to call out anyone specifically, but if telling my story makes it apparent who that was, I can't avoid it.)  I met with that pastor at his home and was requested to bring a friend to the meeting, which I did.  During the meeting, I talked about some of my past experiences and my struggle with my faith.    We met a couple more times which proved to be helpful to me. 

When the new location opened in Plymouth, I immediately began going to church there, as it was much closer to my home.  The start-up congregation was very small and the members became close very quickly.  It was a great environment for me given my trust issues and PTSD.  I continued to receive counseling from the same pastor and became very close to he and his wife.  I babysat their children and spent a lot of time at their home.  I also attended the Thanksgiving and Christmas holidays with the pastor's family.   I asked them both upfront if I was just a project to them, because I had heard the rumors about church members "saving" people and then moving on to the next non-believer.  I was told that I was definitely not a project and that they considered me their sister (I wasn't sure what that meant exactly, but I was convinced I would be friends with them going forward).  I began to trust them more deeply and shared very specific and vulnerable details of my assaults with both of them.  I was still getting counseling from the pastor, who was then fully aware of the complicated struggles I was facing.   I had been told that he was the "counseling pastor" and I assumed he had some education in that area, but I didn't ask the question, which was a failure on my part.  My depression got significantly worse and I was told to believe and pray more so that it would be alleviated. 

I threw myself "all in" and became more involved in the church.  I joined a singles small group and started to make solid friendships.  Soon, I felt like I had become a member of a whole new family.  I let myself trust my new friends and started to believe that God was now a part of my life.  I went through the whole saving and baptism process.  I still had some serious questions about the bible and its truth, but I did think that God existed and I now had a place to go to seek comfort. 

Some of the things that did concern me about the church were the responses I got whenever I questioned the teachings of the pastors.  This came from the pastors themselves and from other church members.  I was comfortable being assertive about discussing my contrary views with respect to all aspects of my life, and didn't hold back at EC.   However in this situation, I was told flat out that the pastors knew how to interpret the bible and were correct in their views.  Anytime I questioned the validity of the pastors (ex. that they didn't have a seminary background), I was shut down and told to just believe they knew what they were doing.  I was also told not to spend time with my non-christian friends if I had tried to save them and they had resisted.   This included my sister who I was very close with.  Luckily she and my other two close friends wouldn't let me push them away, but I did try and spend less time with them.  I was told to focus on my Christian friends instead, which I also did. 

Everything seemed to be going along great - until I was sexually assaulted in my apartment parking garage in January of 1996.  I immediately told a friend from church who called the pastor and his wife.  When I talked to him, I told him I didn't want to report it to the police.  This was because I didn't want others to find out about my past assaults.  He talked to me and treated me with respect, but when I tried to talk to his wife about it, she was cold and distant.  She started to distance herself from me immediately.  I asked her about her actions but she told me her life had suddenly become very busy.  Several weeks later, I confronted the pastor and was told the same thing.  I knew there was dishonesty going on with them, but could not get a straight answer.  Finally, I was told by the pastor that I had been a project and that it looked like I had been able to move forward and make new friends who could now help me.  It was a devastating blow and I felt like I had been misled the entire time I had thought we were friends.   

I told my church friends about what the pastor and his wife had done and I was called a liar and told that I was slandering them.  They said they couldn't be around me if I said negative things about the pastor.  Many started to drift away from me at that time, but some remained by me - although most of them wouldn't allow me to talk negatively about the pastor.  I was told that "Satan" was misleading me and that I needed to spend more time to get right with God.   Other friends backed away with no explanation at all.

In addition I was told by church members that God didn't protect me from being assaulted because I questioned my faith and didn't pray enough.  They assured me it wouldn't have happened to them because they knew that God loved them and would never let that happen to them.   These were the people who help me develop my faith and now I was being chastised (and punished in their minds) for not doing it correctly.  Soon, my support system had dwindled down to a few people that I could still trust.  None of these people were staunch EC supporters, so they believed what I was saying about the church.

I tried to talk to another pastor about what was happening and was told he couldn't even hear what I wanted to say because it would be slandering the pastor.  I then contacted two additional pastors who said the same thing.  I was also told that when there was a conflict, many people chose to leave the church and they had wished them well.  I was appalled at their lack of accountability and that they had no system for members to resolve complaints in the church.

Many months later, the pastor's wife told me that the reason she had backed away was that she hadn't believed I had been sexually assaulted.  She said she didn't tell me before because she thought she would be talking to a fool, which I assume meant that I wasn't a true believer.  She also said that she had prayed to God to show her that I had been assaulted and He hadn't done it, which indicated I was lying about what happened.  I felt like I was immersed in some surreal universe where God was accusing me of lying.  The only conclusions I could draw were that God was lying, she was lying or it hadn't happened.  None of which made any sense to me. 

I believe it was at that point where my already weak faith was destroyed.
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wisemind
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« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2018, 08:18:40 am »

I am so sorry, Lisa1863. I hear you, believe you, and I care deeply about what you experienced. Thank you for telling your story.
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Watching
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« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2018, 08:28:52 am »

I am so very sorry, Lisa1863, for what you have experienced.  That is not Christ-like behavior on the part of anyone at EC that was involved in this.  I am still a member of an EC church, but yours and stories like yours are causing me a lot of concern.  I'm so sorry for your hurt and pain and hope that, perhaps through this forum, you find your voice and a way to begin healing the pain.  My heart breaks for you - and anyone who has experienced hurt at the hands of another child of God.  This is not right. 
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jeromydaviddarling
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« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2018, 08:45:34 am »

Guys does no one here stop and think "Hmmm, someone posting anonymously, their side of the story - I wonder what the nameless people they're referring to would have to say about their side of the story?" This is not the format or place to be posting these stories and it hurts other victims of sexual abuse (like my own mother and wife) who have boldly come forward with their faces and their lives and found freedom, healing, peace, love, grace and understanding in the same church and around the same people. Lisa we have no way of knowing if you're making this all up, if you are who you say you are, nothing. We have nothing to go off of. If all these things really happened to you (before and after the church) this kind of posting will not bring you any healing or peace whatsoever. It will continue to let the people to feel hurt and abused you, abuse you over and over again and it allows people to abdicate their own personal responsibility in all the relationships that have been burned. Just because you read a story on the internet, doesn't mean it's true. It's this kind of anonymous posting that allows people spread lie after lie, with no consequence. It just stirs doubts and fears and anxieties into every corner of a persons faith and relationship, which according this very website, is now defined as abusing another person.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2018, 03:24:08 am by Lisa1863 » Logged
jeromydaviddarling
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« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2018, 08:49:02 am »

Incidentally could you be referring to John and Suzanne Van Dyck? That's around the time they were pastoring at this church
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iamnotafraid
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« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2018, 09:01:07 am »

Jeremy stop tellin people how to heal and just leave her alone.

Why is she on here if she wants to be left alone? She wants peace and healing? She's 20 years removed from her story. This place is not for finding hope and healing.
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wisemind
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« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2018, 09:15:12 am »

The passage of time does not necessarily produce peace and healing for the hurt many of these people have suffered. Kindness, compassion, therapy to help cope with trauma, and the search for truth as they examine what they experienced and what can help them move forward... and maybe give them the ability to share their experience with people who understand. There will always be scars, though, even if they experience peace and healing.
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jeromydaviddarling
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« Reply #7 on: March 13, 2018, 09:27:46 am »

Jeremy stop tellin people how to heal and just leave her alone.

Friend you have absolutely no independent way to know if this person is telling the truth or is who they say they are. This slippery slope from which there is no return. You're believing it because you want validation for you own UNDEALT with hurts. This is not a Biblical approach, on any conceivable level, to dealing with hurts and past offenses - even if it is true....
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iamnotafraid
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« Reply #8 on: March 13, 2018, 01:11:06 pm »

The passage of time does not necessarily produce peace and healing for the hurt many of these people have suffered. Kindness, compassion, therapy to help cope with trauma, and the search for truth as they examine what they experienced and what can help them move forward... and maybe give them the ability to share their experience with people who understand. There will always be scars, though, even if they experience peace and healing.

I can agree that kindness and compassion from others (as well as therapy) are beneficial to our healing. I do not know Lisa's personal assaults and I don't claim to know how they have affected her. I've been through therapy in the early 90's and learned a lot about emotions as they relate to our deep wounds and never knew how hard it was for me to experience grief and sadness. My brain would quickly switch to anger. When Jesus radically changed my life about 10 years later, after hearing the gospel a dozen times it connected with me and I was completely transformed.  In fact, in all honesty I rarely ever think of the sexual abuse I suffered. It doesn't affect me and I don't even associate myself (who I am now) with those memories. I believe Jesus has truly healed me of that pain and those memories. I don't go there. I keep my thoughts on Jesus and He keeps renewing me daily. Part of this growth and healing has come from being in many small groups where I've shared my story, connected with others and witnessed God continue to polish and refine me. Every day I think about how precious I am to my Savior. It is my thought life that has been my greatest spiritual discipline. This I also practice on others. I don't believe "time" heals wounds but I do believe Jesus does and He heals scars.
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Heidi
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« Reply #9 on: March 13, 2018, 02:16:40 pm »

.

[i]Are you able to say if it was Pattersons or Van Dycks?  No pastor would ever  tell you that you were a project.  Are these your words or truly the pastor's?  [/i]

This is an example of spiritual abuse- Why would you saw that no Pastor would ever say you were a project?  That is exactly what Lisa's experience was.  She was not heard or believed when she was hurt by the pastor, or his wife.
Lisa- I am sorry, you are once again not being heard.

Heidi van Dyck Anfinson
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Rebel in a Good Way
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« Reply #10 on: March 13, 2018, 02:47:30 pm »

Heidi, thanks for sharing.  I am so sorry that in your time of great vulnerability you were treated this way.  Thanks for writing out your first part.  Right now might not be the best time to find healing on this forum, but in general you know you are sharing with people who understand and many who have been there themselves.  I had no idea how devastating spiritual abuse could be before I walked through some things myself, but it makes sense because it affects the very foundation  of who we think God is, who we think we are, and how we think the world operates.

I look forward to part 2 when you are ready.  
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iamnotafraid
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« Reply #11 on: March 13, 2018, 03:23:42 pm »

.

[i]Are you able to say if it was Pattersons or Van Dycks?  No pastor would ever  tell you that you were a project.  Are these your words or truly the pastor's?  [/i]

This is an example of spiritual abuse- Why would you saw that no Pastor would ever say you were a project?  That is exactly what Lisa's experience was.  She was not heard or believed when she was hurt by the pastor, or his wife.
Lisa- I am sorry, you are once again not being heard.

Heidi van Dyck Anfinson

Yes, can you clarify GTA - do you mean no God honoring pastor? We obviously know all humans sin so there is the potential of pastors saying hurtful things. Lisa said she was at the Plymouth location, this would seem to make sense since John Van Dyke was pastoring there at that time. 
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Gladtobegone
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« Reply #12 on: March 13, 2018, 03:38:42 pm »

I think it is  ironic that on a healing forum that exists because of negative experiences in GCx churches that GCx people are bullying, harassing, making snarky comments and telling hurting people their experiences are wrong!  Perfect!  Exactly why I left along with the erroneous teachings!  Bringing back all the memories - WOW  Shocked
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iamnotafraid
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« Reply #13 on: March 13, 2018, 03:46:07 pm »

.

[i]Are you able to say if it was Pattersons or Van Dycks?  No pastor would ever  tell you that you were a project.  Are these your words or truly the pastor's?  [/i]

This is an example of spiritual abuse- Why would you saw that no Pastor would ever say you were a project?  That is exactly what Lisa's experience was.  She was not heard or believed when she was hurt by the pastor, or his wife.
Lisa- I am sorry, you are once again not being heard.

Heidi van Dyck Anfinson

This is what I posted on another thread, since it buried already.

Well it certainly needs a different name then.  Abuse is the new term...everyone has been abused emotionally;abuse is the new trendy verb to give more emotional impact to your story.  It really diminishes and demeans those that have suffered abuse.  It really makes me plain angry.  I would say for something to qualify as abuse, there needs to be a significant amount of fear, a kind of fear that makes you tremble.  I am serious about this.  I have been abused...never sexually.  But I dealt with verbal and physical abuse for about 10 years.  Many of you just have NO IDEA.  I have also spoken before about a friend that was in a sick and abusive church and family.  I am sure if this friend was on this forum, she would have the same opinion about what you consider abuse compared to what she went through.  Her stories literally make you sick.  Abuse is not subtle...EVER! - as the title of the book suggests.  If abuse is subtle, it is just not abuse, plain and simple. Maybe you can say "I was spiritually hurt, mis-treated, or wounded," but not abuse.  This spiritually abused term makes my blood boil...especially when I have heard some stories of how people felt they were "abused" by the church.

If you were ever abused physically or verbally, and are on this forum...do you not feel the same?  Honestly tell me if you feel as if the use of this term bothers you, or diminishes what you have experienced, and why or why not.   


Certainly the word choices seem extreme and over exaggerated to me. I have been the victim of sexual abuse (date rape, men shoved my hands down their pants, was called humiliating names by men) as well as verbally abused. I've also heard co-workers make accusations of sexual abuse by our boss because they overheard him making inappropriate jokes. In my opinion, that was not sexual "abuse." Inappropriate - yes. Abuse - no.
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Heidi
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« Reply #14 on: March 13, 2018, 04:04:51 pm »

Lisa-
Thanks for sharing your painful story.
Some understand it and some do not.  
Thanks for having the courage to speak out on this forum.  Your story matters, and you matter.

I was with you when you courageously spoke to John van Dyck, to Doug Patterson and Mark Bowen at your house, to Brent Knox and Mark Darling at the church office.  You did your part to tell your story.  You addressed the issues of not having a system of accountability or a way to address concerns. You told them you were appalled at their lack of accountability and no way for member's to resolve complaints.  You told them how hurt you had been by the Plymouth pastors, pastors wife and the church body at Plymouth. ( New Hope) That is on them now.

To be treated like a " project" or be shunned in a relationship is extremely hurtful.  It still hurts my heart when I think about what happened in your experience at Evergreen.  
Your friend- Heidi van Dyck Anfinson

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GodisFaithful
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« Reply #15 on: March 13, 2018, 07:33:51 pm »

Lisa, I don't think you are a bogus person and thank you for sharing your story.  I hope you will find healing and hope.  I care. 

I private messaged you.  If you are new here, just look at "my messages" and click on that.
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Lisa1863
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« Reply #16 on: March 14, 2018, 03:19:05 am »

I want to thank those of you who posted in support of me.  Namely:  Wisemind, Reblinagoodway, watching, Restinhimalone, gladtobegone and Heidi.  While my intention in posting my story wasn't to look for such support, I want you to know that I greatly appreciate you reaching out to offer me such kind words. 
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Lisa1863
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« Reply #17 on: March 14, 2018, 05:52:17 am »

Guys does no one here stop and think "Hmmm, someone posting anonymously, their side of the story - I wonder what the nameless people they're referring to would have to say about their side of the story?" This is not the format or place to be posting these stories and it hurts other victims of sexual abuse (like my own mother and wife) who have boldly come forward with their faces and their lives and found freedom, healing, peace, love, grace and understanding in the same church and around the same people. Lisa we have no way of knowing if you're making this all up, if you are who you say you are, nothing. We have nothing to go off of. If all these things really happened to you (before and after the church) this kind of posting will not bring you any healing or peace whatsoever. It will continue to let the people to feel hurt and abused you, abuse you over and over again and it allows people to abdicate their own personal responsibility in all the relationships that have been burned. Just because you read a story on the internet, doesn't mean it's true. It's this kind of anonymous posting that allows people spread lie after lie, with no consequence. It just stirs doubts and fears and anxieties into every corner of a persons faith and relationship, which according this very website, is now defined as abusing another person.

As a rule, I don't engage with people who are unable to have an emotionally mature conversation, as it is a waste of my time and energy.  However, in this situation I am putting aside my usual stance to give you some information that I hope may be of use to you. 

My name is Lisa Burkett.  The only reason I didn't originally post as myself was because I was trying to avoid calling out people involved in my situation.  They already know who they are and I have told all of them personally how their actions have affected my life. 

As far as your accusation that I did not "boldly coming forward" as a survivor of sexual abuse and sexual assault, you are greatly misinformed.  I was honest and open with my past experiences back when I was a EC member and continue to be today. In fact, I founded an organization five years ago that trains PTSD service dogs for first responders.  As part of my willingness to help others who have experienced trauma, I have publicly (in my business plan, on our website, in presentations I have made, and at public events) and privately shared my story with others who have PTSD, as well as the general public.  As far as EC goes, in addition to my friends, I shared my story with five pastors either in a counseling setting or as a part of my attempt to hold them responsible for their lack of accountability to each other and to the congregation at large. 

Regarding women fabricating stories about sexual assault:   I would like to share some statistics with you.  A government funded research study found that approximately 63% of women DO NOT report incidences of sexual assault to the police.  In addition, the percentage of women who report false accounts of sexual violence are 2-7%.  Based on those statistics, if 100 women came forward, at the MOST 2 - 7 of them would be reporting a false claim.  In addition, one of the reason a report is classified as false is that the victim did not come forward at the time (which can be for many other reasons than the report being untrue).  If you take that variable into consideration and reapply the statistical analysis, even fewer women actually lie about their experience. The link to a PDF file summarizing the study can be found at:  www.nsvrc.org/sites/default/files/Publications_NSVRC_Overview_False-Reporting.pdf

In the event that you bring up the similarity between accounts of sexual violence as an indicator of a false report, I would like to offer you some information about how repeat offenders typically commit their crimes.  Offenders who habitually commit sexual abuse/sexual assault (and other crimes in general) develop a method when they engage in criminal activity.  When their tactics work, they use them to create a specific pattern in order to be successful at finding victims and committing crimes against them.  That is why when women report sexual assault/abuse incidences regarding the same perpetrator, they describe their experience with very similar details. ( I have a degree in criminology, an ongoing relationship with police departments [as part of my job] and am an attorney.  Just in case you want to argue that I don't have the knowledge to offer this information).

As far as what is going on with your father at Evergreen, it is not my place to definitively determine whether the accusations are true, but I am more than free to say that I support the women who have come forward (whether publicly or anonymously) and believe they are telling the truth.  This is my right to do, and in return, I respect your right to stand behind your father (in fact, I would expect nothing less).  However, when you disrespect others and their rights to believe differently from yourself, you only seem less credible.  (Just my opinion based on my experiences with people who get defensive when trying to present their views). 

I can tell you myself what the "nameless people" had to say about their side of the story.  Without calling any individual out (again, not my place), some responded by apologizing and taking responsibility for their actions (this happened both in private and in front of other people).  Others responded with denials, excuses and an unwillingness to hear what I had to say (also in private and in front of others).  I was thankful to those who stood up and admitted their harmful behavior and disappointed with those that did not.  I was extremely upfront with my responses, and we all should have left those conversations knowing exactly where we stood with each other.

I am not even going to address your comments about the purpose of this forum.  After reading the rules, I don't see anything that says what can and cannot be discussed here, only that people should be treated respectfully which I believe I have done in this post.

Also, it is absolutely not your place to tell me (or any other survivor) how they should go about their healing process.  Merely knowing women who have been assaulted and abused and their personal path to healing, does not make you an expert on every other woman who has been a victim.  (It doesn't seem like I should have to tell you or anyone else this, but apparently I do). 

Along these lines, do not presume to tell me what will or will not help me heal from my past - it is both arrogant and inappropriate to tell a complete stranger how to deal with any abusive experience. 

While posting anonymously is one way to precipitate a lie, it is not conclusive indicator that someone is, in fact, lying.  More likely, it is used as a way for individuals to protect themselves from the disparaging comments and accusations that people like you seem compelled to convey.  I would like you to understand that I do not feel the need to defend myself to you or anyone else.  I have been truthful in everything I have posted and proving it to you is not even on my radar.  I have offered an account of my experience and people can take it or leave it.

Your comment about about my posting stirring doubts, fears and anxiety into a persons faith and relationship (which I think you are referring to spiritual abuse, although you are not clear in this) is an unsubstantiated accusation.  This type of unfounded accusation seems to be the very thing you are accusing others of asserting.  Rest assured I am not an "abuser" on any level and people should certainly not be afraid I am attempting to spiritually abuse them.  In fact, I have not mentioned religious beliefs or spirituality once in this entire post.  It would be in your best interest to allow people to determine for themselves whether they are being abused.  In addition, telling people that they are believing my post as a form of validation for their "own UNDEALT with hurts" is not something you should assert unless you have a background in psychology (even then it would be sketchy to offer that kind of observation to another person in this forum).  As I believe I made perfectly clear in my original post, that is not something an untrained person is qualified to do.

Lastly, please do not talk about me as if I am not participating in this conversation.  If you have something to say about me at least have the decency to address me directly.  I have now revealed my true identity to you, so that shouldn't be a problem.

I welcome respectful questions and comments and will answer any post that is directed to me, but I will avoid engaging with anyone who is hotheaded or inflammatory.

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« Reply #18 on: March 14, 2018, 06:05:49 am »

Wow, thank you for sharing lisa!
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Lisa1863
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« Reply #19 on: March 14, 2018, 06:14:31 am »

.

[i]Are you able to say if it was Pattersons or Van Dycks?  No pastor would ever  tell you that you were a project.  Are these your words or truly the pastor's?  [/i]

This is an example of spiritual abuse- Why would you saw that no Pastor would ever say you were a project?  That is exactly what Lisa's experience was.  She was not heard or believed when she was hurt by the pastor, or his wife.
Lisa- I am sorry, you are once again not being heard.

Heidi van Dyck Anfinson

This is what I posted on another thread, since it buried already.

Well it certainly needs a different name then.  Abuse is the new term...everyone has been abused emotionally;abuse is the new trendy verb to give more emotional impact to your story.  It really diminishes and demeans those that have suffered abuse.  It really makes me plain angry.  I would say for something to qualify as abuse, there needs to be a significant amount of fear, a kind of fear that makes you tremble.  I am serious about this.  I have been abused...never sexually.  But I dealt with verbal and physical abuse for about 10 years.  Many of you just have NO IDEA.  I have also spoken before about a friend that was in a sick and abusive church and family.  I am sure if this friend was on this forum, she would have the same opinion about what you consider abuse compared to what she went through.  Her stories literally make you sick.  Abuse is not subtle...EVER! - as the title of the book suggests.  If abuse is subtle, it is just not abuse, plain and simple. Maybe you can say "I was spiritually hurt, mis-treated, or wounded," but not abuse.  This spiritually abused term makes my blood boil...especially when I have heard some stories of how people felt they were "abused" by the church.

If you were ever abused physically or verbally, and are on this forum...do you not feel the same?  Honestly tell me if you feel as if the use of this term bothers you, or diminishes what you have experienced, and why or why not.   


According to Merriam-Webster, the definition of abuse is:  Verb -  "to put to a wrong or improper use."  Noun: "a corrupt practice or custom" and "improper or excessive use."  It also includes, of course , physical or threatening actions.  There is no requirement of fear is or physical contact, although it can be a part of the action.  Using this definition, abuse can be subtle or more obvious.  It still falls under the definition of abuse.  As a result, spiritual abuse could be the misuse of religion by a pastor, priest or leader of a church.  

I honestly don't care how people specifically define their experiences - It doesn't make them any less painful.  Also, comparisons are inappropriate.  Everyone comes into an abusive situation with a different background.  Just because someone else was treated differently doesn't mean their experience doesn't affect them in a similar way.  It's not a competition and shouldn't be treated that way.
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