My Experience with GCM

Welcome to De-Commissioned, a place for former members of the Great Commission movement (aka GCM, GCC, GCAC, GCI, the Blitz) to discuss problems they've experienced in the association's practices and theology.

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[steelgirl]

I grew up in a traditional conservative Baptist Church.  I was rather curious about the church on campus.  When I graduated from Ohio State University, I discovered that New Life Church had a vibrant singles group unlike what I grew up in.  It was a great church for the 1st 2 yrs.  I was in  a great life group.  Things however changed 2 yrs later when there was a big move to Orlando.  When people to Orlando, friends moved. Life groups were restructured.    This thing really pisses me off to this day was that in order to be in a life group you had to be asked by a leader.  I however was able to be in an accountability group with a mentor and this other person who needed to be fixed.  I eventually got asked to a small group I went and they were nice but I did not connect the way I would of with the one closer to home.

In addition I was going through some difficult stuff.  I don't think many of the leaders understood why I graduated with a liberal arts degree especially those who did not have a college degree.   :roll:
During this time if I had work it was through employment agencies, but nothing ever steady.  I don't think they approved of the fact I still lived with my parents.  I wonder if there was a misconception that has been alive to this day.
Looking back I don't know why I stayed like I did except I did not know anything else other than where I grew up.  However 3 yrs later I did leave because the leaders of the singles community were heading to the east and west.  I am glad I did because towards the end, the sermons were not all that thought provoking.

I have browsed and I saw a young Christian go into leadership.  In addition I work with somebody who goes to a sister church and whose husband is one of the elders.   Some of her behaviors are rather evident that she is not the most mature in her faith, especially when I heard talk to her son one break.

[exshep]

I do not remember New Life.  What time period are we looking at? I vaguely remember the Orlando move.

I had a friend in the Columbus church from  1982-c2000.  I remember and still cringe at the ultra disipleship.   Curiously I had a conversation with a man who is in the biblical counseling training program at church.  (Not to worry, it is an intensive program with checks and accountability. I am OK with it)  He made a curious comment about reconciliation.  He had a curious spin with Matt 7.1ff [Judge not lest ye be judged ...]  In reconciliation the one with the log in eye should go first to explain his faults and ask for forgiveness.    It is also similar to the AA concept of cleaning one's own side of the street.   Paul Martin at Wellspring was a participant in "Cults and Codependency" conference in the late 80's.   I never attended, but the dynamics involved made sense.   I  remember a speeaker in an AA talk who roared in  true Black revivalist  preacher style, "The one thing I must remember is there is a god and I AM NOT IT!!"  

A lot of GC members thought they knew what was best for their brothers and sisters. There seemed to have been an epidemic of taking the speck out of the brother's eye without regard to the log in their own. Now that is driving blind.  It was like the JOY principle  [Jesus First, Others Second, Yourself last]  through a slight twist was turned to OJY principle.  Poetics aside, it was not terribly joyful.  Leaders, perhaps well meaning, thought they knew what was the best for the sheep.  Obviously we all  know well that worked out.    I was driven batty by "talk to the elders, they have the answers".  Hello, where is the Holy Spirit and proper biblical exegisis in all this?

[steelgirl]

I do not remember New Life.  What time period are we looking at? I vaguely remember the Orlando move.

I was there from 1999 to around 04.  I started checking out another church back in O3.  Before I left there would  be wknds I would attend both churches.  I however was getting fed more with the church I now attend.

I had a friend in the Columbus church from  1982-c2000.  I remember and still cringe at the ultra disipleship.   Curiously I had a conversation with a man who is in the biblical counseling training program at church.  (Not to worry, it is an intensive program with checks and accountability. I am OK with it)  He made a curious comment about reconciliation.  He had a curious spin with Matt 7.1ff [Judge not lest ye be judged ...]  In reconciliation the one with the log in eye should go first to explain his faults and ask for forgiveness.    It is also similar to the AA concept of cleaning one's own side of the street.   Paul Martin at Wellspring was a participant in "Cults and Codependency" conference in the late 80's.   I never attended, but the dynamics involved made sense.   I  remember a speeaker in an AA talk who roared in  true Black revivalist  preacher style, "The one thing I must remember is there is a god and I AM NOT IT!!"  

A lot of GC members thought they knew what was best for their brothers and sisters. There seemed to have been an epidemic of taking the speck out of the brother's eye without regard to the log in their own.

Perhaps that was an issue.  I had some good experiences, however community really suffered after the big move.  I am still suffering some of the effects.  Perhaps this is part of the reason God led me to seek help from a professional Christian counselor.  

It really bothered me that people percieved me as not motivated, which is not true.  I wonder if perceptions live on because is there is one person who I occasionally see at the church I attend who I wonder if I am working.  Alright I still have not found constant full time work.

One of the frikkin misconceptions that people got was the fact I hop from job to job which was anything but the truth.  For the past 3 and a half yrs I have maintained a steady job even if it is not full time.  I have also worked another contract job when it is available for 2 yrs.  There are times especially during Oct/Nov that I have had to work 7 days straight.  Some of it has been out of need, but I have also done it to prove that I don't hop from job to job.  Perhaps this is another story but I am afraid to move on and quit my part-time job even though there could be some changes.  Thats in God's hands.

 Now that is driving blind.  It was like the JOY principle  [Jesus First, Others Second, Yourself last]  through a slight twist was turned to OJY principle.  Poetics aside, it was not terribly joyful.  Leaders, perhaps well meaning, thought they knew what was the best for the sheep.  Obviously we all  know well that worked out.    I was driven batty by "talk to the elders, they have the answers".  Hello, where is the Holy Spirit and proper biblical exegisis in all this?

Anyway I wonder if people percieved me as not being willing to work which was anything farthest from the truth.  Perhaps the fact I worked through staffing agencies was one of the many reasons I did not get into a group.  Back between 01 to when I left and even after people post college were leaving due to lack of community.  I am glad I left when I did because the same yr I left things really got worst.  I heard that the leader of one church plant in Amsterdam was having problems and he had to leave.  

2 yrs after I left I discovered that some people who left to help plant a  church in LA moved back  due to pressures and problems of it be a younger church.  It must of been too hard to handle.
  In addition one of my friends who was a hardline GCMer finally left because her mentor got let go.    

The college side of the church seemed to be healthy when I was there.  Back in college I was with another group, however GCM had a vibant college group.

Around my area, there is one GCAC church that must be doing something right for I understand around 2,000 attend here.

[exshep]

Around my area, there is one GCAC church that must be doing something right for I understand around 2,000 attend here.

Hard to say.  I was living in Texas at that point.  I was at Grace Community Church in Plano. It was the healthiest. The only big mistake I saw the church  make was corrected in short order.  

Chris Martin and Tom Short at Linworth have gone the extra mile on the abuses.  Somehow it has not filtered into the rank and file membership.   I have also cringed hearing a sermon at Mosaic with old "Satan will try to use critics to draw you away from the church"  Same old same old.   The hidden message is GC has the truth, other churches do not, so stay safe with us.  New Song has addressed some abuses and have  a Celebrate Recovery group. Heritage seems to be the more ecumenical of the Columbus churches.  I have listened to internet feeds of services.  Somehow it just did not do it for me.  This is more analogous to trying to find to a new church moving into a new city.   If it is of any consolation, one of the psalmist penned, "Is there righteousness in Zion?"  That verse helps me know I am not alone in my frustration and grief.

[steelgirl]

Around my area, there is one GCAC church that must be doing something right for I understand around 2,000 attend here.

Hard to say.  I was living in Texas at that point.  I was at Grace Community Church in Plano. It was the healthiest. The only big mistake I saw the church  make was corrected in short order.  

Chris Martin and Tom Short at Linworth have gone the extra mile on the abuses.  Somehow it has not filtered into the rank and file membership.   I have also cringed hearing a sermon at Mosaic with old "Satan will try to use critics to draw you away from the church"  Same old same old.  

When was this message preached?  I don't remember this message.  Are you sure they were not talking about just church in general.  


I remember hearing bs from an old friend around 2003 that those who left to go Vineyard were escaping accountabily at Mosaic since it is so big.  I knew of people going to Vineyard and I started checking it out.  I now attend there.
BTW that friend no longer go to Mosaic she now attends another good church which is not at all affiliated with GCM.

 The hidden message is GC has the truth, other churches do not, so stay safe with us.

Not all GCMers are like that.  I had a friend that moved to Orlando to help with the plant in Orlando.  Anyway the next yr, she just did not want to go there anymore.  One of the pastors was quite understanding about that and even suggested she find something that would encourage her to grow.However there were some people in the church who gave her grief.


I hope that not to many GCM churches believe that they are the only ones with the truth.  I don't remember much when I was little.  But from the time my parents were in college till I was 9 my family was apart of this Bible Church that originated in Southern and Southeastern Ohio.  I have heard stories of major abuse and how you had to do stuff like teach Bible Club or work at the camp.  You were expected to be a counselor whether or you liked the outdoors or not.  Perhaps my mom and dad made not the wisest choice, so 15 to 28 yrs later I follow in similar footstep, even though GCM is more open than my Baptist background.  I recall going and fellowshiping with friends at clubs in the Brewery District.  I especially liked dancing at Ludlows.

Heritage seems to be the more ecumenical of the Columbus churches.  I have listened to internet feeds of services.  Somehow it just did not do it for me.  This is more analogous to trying to find to a new church moving into a new city.   If it is of any consolation, one of the psalmist penned, "Is there righteousness in Zion?"  That verse helps me know I am not alone in my frustration and grief.

Before I left a friend from 4,000-5,000 miles thought I was being selfish because I was wanting to go to a place where I would be truly fed and not just given a bottle of milk.  

When was that infamous message preached that you mentioned earlier in the post? Then again what if it was just about people leaving church in general?

[exshep]

When was that infamous message preached that you mentioned earlier in the post? Then again what if it was just about people leaving church in general?

I was too cheap to buy the deluxe version of Real Player to save it to disk.  It was  entitled "Won't Get Fooled Again"  named after the same hit by the Who. It was at Mosaic in October  2004.  Mosaic only kept a  year long archive.  So it has gone into cyberspace.  The sermon was homeletically sound until that zinger at the end. My reaction was  a combination of anger and cold sweat anxiety.  It looked at the computer,  "It figures.  Same old same old".  I went dejectedly to bed.

Which church in Ohio has  2K active?  There is a megachurch in Toledo. Heritage is  a sizeable congregation.  I know Linworth had to go to two services.  I heard Tom Short in fall 2006 when I was up for a reunion at Ohio University.   I knew  a couple of people from New Song who had  a fun blog going.

[steelgirl]

When was that infamous message preached that you mentioned earlier in the post? Then again what if it was just about people leaving church in general?

I was too cheap to buy the deluxe version of Real Player to save it to disk.  It was  entitled "Won't Get Fooled Again"  named after the same hit by the Who. It was at Mosaic in October  2004.  Mosaic only kept a  year long archive.  So it has gone into cyberspace.  The sermon was homeletically sound until that zinger at the end. My reaction was  a combination of anger and cold sweat anxiety.  It looked at the computer,  "It figures.  Same old same old".  I went dejectedly to bed.

A lot of people were leaving around that time.  I officially left May of 04.  Others were leaving too that yr.  I recall seeing one friend at the New Members Class back in Sept 04.  I was surprised to see her, but then again not totally.  I am glad I left Mosaic when I left especially if this garbage is being preached.

Which church in Ohio has  2K active?  There is a megachurch in Toledo. Heritage is  a sizeable congregation.  I know Linworth had to go to two services.  I heard Tom Short in fall 2006 when I was up for a reunion at Ohio University.   I knew  a couple of people from New Song who had  a fun blog going.

I thought Heritage had around 2000.  From 01 to 04 I encountered things that were more abusive than I needed to encounter at times.

[steelgirl]

"Satan will try to use critics to draw you away from the church"

I want to think the best about Mosaic, since the reason why I left had more to do with where I was in my walk.  My present church has ministries for many gifts including a group for my particular gift.  I have created some material that I have brought to this group that would have drove a few people batty, but not at this group.  If it portrays an honest look at life through my eyes they don't think that something is the matter as  was the case with a few leaders who wanted to fix me.

I recall 4 yrs earlier that one of the elders said that New Life valued unity with other churchess  in the area.  Then again as I stated earlier one of my friends said that where I started attending was an escape from accountability for many people from Mosaic.  I recall hanging out with this friend at a wedding, we were kind of tight.  However that particual remark about escaping accountability was extremely ofensive.

Hopefully this person has changed her way of thinking, since she does not go to a GCM affiliated church anymore.   In addition she moved in with a daughter of one of my parents friends.   She and this  other person attend another good church in the area. My parents and these friends met in a fundy abherant church 25 to 30 yrs earlier.  I have heard stories about stuff that went on in this group when my parents were part of it.  I was too young to remember however some of the experiences I had after the move to Orlando unfortunately compares with the abherrant treatment that my parents and friends of theirs suffered until my family and their friends left this group.

[jehu]

Let's examine the converse of the statement: "God will use apologists to draw you into the church." Comments?