Truth Lover ~ Post #1 ~ Written July 7, 2007
Warm greetings and God’s grace to all of you here! First I would like to say that I empathize greatly with each and every one of you, as I too have been through some very hard times in GC and am now in a better place, by God’s grace! I learned of this site last Sunday, July 1, and I spent most of Monday and Tuesday reading much of what is written here, so I do feel as if I know all of you a little. I registered to join this site on July 4th, 2007. I have never posted on a forum, so please bear with me as my experience is mostly in writing letters. But I felt this was too important not to speak with all of you so I will try to be as concise as possible, yet thorough and clear. Thank you for your patience!
I am the wife of a pastor who came to GC in the 70's and was recognized as an elder a few years later. I came in the 80's. I do thank God for leading me to GC as it is where I met my husband and some very dear friends. I must say that it was quite amazing at first as I had been saved only two months prior to meeting ones from GC, although I was quite a bit older in physical years. I was amazed by the group’s sincere love and devotion to the Lord and genuine concern for people. It was so refreshing to be around sincere, down-to-earth and dedicated people ~ ones truly zealous for the Lord, His people, and the lost. It was a world I had never known existed and I jumped in with great joy and enthusiasm! I was hungry to learn what God had to say in His Word about Himself and how I, as a new Christian, should think and live. There were wonderful times of fellowship around brief, but to me at the time, nourishing new teachings from the Bible. There was the most wonderful singing ~ especially the Scripture songs! I too was very zealous as a new believer, and God gave me grace to share my new-found faith in our Lord Jesus with others ~ He even saved some in my path as a result partly of my sharing the Gospel, but all by His grace and power of course! (2 Cor. 4:5-7; 2 Cor. 3:4-5). During my first two years there, before I was married, my future husband was also my home group leader and he taught me how to make the most of my time alone with the Lord ~ reading His Word and writing notes on it in a notebook ~ meditating on the Word and praying. I wrote out many verses, several every day, ~ and prayers and thoughts on what I was learning from the Bible. It was wonderful!
After we married I slowly became aware of some of the things many of you have listed. Here’s one example of un-Biblical authority of some of the leaders ~ a grown man decided it was time for he and his family to move to a far away location and they counseled him not to because it was not God’s will for him to do that ~ to which I said to my husband: “How could they know what God’s will is for him in this situation?”
The seeker movement was now in full swing and our church was growing fast! But many of the old guard were leaving ~ they wanted to be fed more. Some said that it was selfish to want to be fed more when there are ones who are lost ~ and you should be able to feed yourself now. Others still wanted more teaching. When it became apparent that many were in disagreement over this, ones went different ways ~ we followed the path of more Bible teaching, but with less people. It was heartbreaking to be apart from many former friends, but we were glad to be back to the Bible and away from the “man-centered” show style. My husband began to have a greater role in teaching the Bible, and we found out that indeed God had gifted him in this area! He actually taught through whole books of the Bible! Without any training he was not able to go as deep as he is now, but back then it was meaty and refreshing!
Our big problems arose when we both just naturally wanted learn what the Bible had to say, in a deeper way. I remember that a book on the Attributes of God really opened our eyes to some truths we had never heard taught at all! We began to read other good books about God and godly Christians from the past ~ not just books on evangelism, which was all we really heard recommended, ~ but ones about godly pastors who taught the Bible well and regularly. We desired to learn about everything ~ God’s holiness; His sovereignty; His love; His mercy and goodness, His justice, that He is all-knowing and all powerful; man’s sinfulness and total inability to come to God on his own; how He wants His church and His pastors to function; the return of our Lord Jesus...One time we wanted to go to a conference on prophecy by a gifted Bible teacher ~ and we were told not to because it might cause us to learn something they didn’t believe. I had never heard any teaching on prophecy at all in the years I had been there, yet we were told it was wrong for us to learn from someone else. Since it was for our anniversary the other pastor said maybe we should just go to a nice bed & breakfast instead. We went anyway~ we wanted to learn!
We began to understand more about God’s sovereignty in everything, including salvation, and we realized that we had never heard any teaching on this at all. When we asked a popular GC evangelist about this he said that in a leaders’ meeting a while back they decided that since they couldn’t agree on this doctrine and others they decided they just would not teach strongly (or at all) one way or the other on these divisive doctrines. I was astounded! It is taught clearly everywhere in the Bible! Also God’s sovereignty is the most God-exalting, man-humbling, and yet comforting doctrine! It is transforming to know that He indeed is sovereign and in total control of everything. Nothing surprises Him or catches Him off-guard because He providentially ordains all events according to His will and purposes. (Eph.1; Isaiah 46:9-11). He moves men’s hearts like a watercourse to do His will. (Prov. 21:1). Yet He is never the author of evil. It is also at the heart of how ones will evangelize. Lack of understanding of this truth is why ones adopt the seeker/church growth methods. If ones believe that man is sovereign and can by his own will and power come to God on his own then that leads to the thinking that we must do whatever it takes to fulfill the great commission! We must make people want to come to Jesus and be saved ~ so we must “become all things to all men” ~(their definition, not what the Bible means by this) ~ except that Eph. 2:1 says that we, before salvation, are dead in our sins and could not come to God on our own ~ (also see John 6:44-45; John 6:65; John 1:12-13). That leads to watered down and short “messages and sharing” so as not to offend instead of preaching the Word with conviction. God’s truth is no longer that important. But He says: “And you shall know the truth and the truth shall make you free.”~John 8:32. Shows and gimmicks to draw ones to church are deemed better than just the Holy Spirit, love of the believers, prayer and the Word. Proper steps of church discipline for real sin issues are not taken much, if at all. Some elders in other places even got into the signs & wonders movement a little... I was shocked to find out that our leaders were not really following the whole Bible (Ps.119:160 “The sum of Thy Word is truth...”; and “All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable...” 2 Tim. 3:16-17), but only what they felt was important ~ according to their definitions (not the Bible’s definitions) of love, truth, unity, humility, church and pastors’ duties... The church is to be the “pillar and support of the truth”~1 Tim. 3:15! And the most loving thing you could do for someone is tell them the truth about God’s holiness, and man’s sinfulness and that if they repent of their sin and turn to God through faith in the Lord Jesus Christ, believing what He did on our behalf when He died and rose again to pay fully for the sins of everyone who ever believes ~ then He would save them! The Bible says that man is responsible to repent and believe, but the Bible also says that man cannot come to God on his own and that if God is drawing ones He will grant them repentance and faith through the power of His Word and Spirit! (Acts 16:14; Acts 11:18; 2 Tim. 2:25; Phil 1:29). Both man’s responsibility and God’s sovereignty are taught in the Bible, therefore both should be taught by pastors and believed. It is the pastor’s and all Christians’ duty to simply proclaim the Gospel fully and accurately, keep praying, and acknowledge and praise God that the results are in His hands. (1 Chron. 29:11-14). All the glory goes to Him! He lets us have a little part in His grand plan of salvation, but He plans it all and brings it to pass through His ordained means! We just need to obey what He tells us to do and believe all that He says.
One Sunday when my husband was in Romans and taught about sin and hell, an important visiting GC pastor said afterwards that he should not have done that since it was baby dedication Sunday and he shouldn’t have offended the visitors. This same pastor also taught once ~ (I was there) ~ that the passage in Acts 17 about the Bereans doesn’t mean you should check out what your pastor teaches, it means that you should be discerning about what you read or watch. I about fell off my chair and asked my husband who was going to talk to him about his public misinterpretation of that verse! The Bereans were checking out the apostle Paul to see if what he taught was in the Scriptures! That was exactly what Paul was teaching! Paul and Silas were in the synagogue teaching and the Bereans “were more noble minded than those in Thessalonica, for they received the word with great eagerness, examining the Scriptures daily, to see whether these things were so.” Of course, not properly interpreting the Bible also leads to the un-Scriptural use of pastoral authority, something that has been mentioned much at this forum. If the leaders don’t believe God really is in control, then they are tempted to overstep their proper boundaries as leaders and put un-Biblical pressure on ones to conform to their outward standard of what they think is needed to get the job done ~ to fulfill the Great Commission. That is man-centered thinking, instead of the God-centered thinking that is overwhelmingly present in the Bible. There’s so much more to say about this, but I am trying to restrain myself!
So here we were in our mid forties ~ a family with several children and I realized my husband was not trained at all by these men. He was given the responsibility when they laid hands on him and appointed him an elder ~ he was responsible before God to handle accurately the Word of truth so he is approved by God and not ashamed before Him (2 Tim. 2:15) ~ and to preach the Word in and out of season (2 Tim. 4:1-4) ~ and to equip the saints for the work of service (Eph. 4:11-13) ~ and to do the work of an evangelist and fulfill his ministry (2 Tim. 4:5) ~ which means preaching the Word which is able to save ones (Romans 10:8-14) ~ and he was going to have to give account to God for how well he fed & cared for the people in his care. This is serious to God and it became very serious to us as well! But he was being asked to not teach what he had come to know and believe and knew he should teach . There was no real unity around the whole Bible but only around certain very basic truths (milk) and GC core values. When he began to learn on his own and discovered certain truths and Biblical principles missing in our church he began to talk to the other elders. This was when it began to get very difficult. I felt at times like I was in a bad dream. I was scared. But God, always faithful to help ones who are looking to properly understand, believe, and obey His truth about everything, brought into our lives some very amazing people. We began to listen to some great Bible teaching and read many more good books to help us understand the Bible better. God gave us some wonderful, older, gifted pastors and teachers to personally encourage us and indeed we needed it! ~ I remember hearing of a GC pastor who taught one Sunday morning that God doesn’t really know everything. I couldn’t sleep very well that night. Later I heard that he admitted that he shouldn’t have said it, but he still believed it.
My husband is a very patient and loyal person. Both of us are team players and have never had any desire for conflict or disunity. We actually like being in the background, so there was never any jealousy or envy (as was suggested). But when it came to either following God’s Words & ways or men’s words & ways, we had to choose God ~ indeed we could do no other! ~ “Unless I am convinced by Scripture and plain reason, my conscience is captive to the Word of God.” ~ Martin Luther. Presently I have on my refrigerator a quote by my husband which he said to me during the difficult time: “Right doctrine rightly unites!” (also see 2 Cor. 4:13, actually I love the whole section from 2 Cor. 3:18-4:18!). He also always has had a great love for the people under his care, so we stayed in that situation a long time because he felt that perhaps God would help the other pastor see the importance of regular Bible teaching without the entertainment type stuff, as he had begun to waver and wanted to go back to the old seeker service partly so we would grow numerically faster. This kind of thinking really reflects a lack of confidence in God’s Word and power to change a person’s heart (Romans 1:16; John 17:17) and I believe this is the main root problem in GC. That’s why there is an overbalance on what we need to do rather than what God does through us as we are believing Him and obedient to His Word and His ways (2 Cor. 3:18; Phil. 2:12-13; 2 Cor. 9:8). Jesus taught clearly that HE has all the authority and we are to go and make disciples...teaching them (and us!) to observe ALL that HE commanded us... and Paul did not shrink from declaring the WHOLE counsel of God.(Acts 20:27-32). “Feed My sheep”, Jesus said! This area of God’s Truth and sound doctrine is the area that my husband has said is the main weak link in GC. All the gifts in the body are needed for a healthy church, but the gifted teacher types were not encouraged to use their gift of digging in the Word to understand it properly and then teach it fully and accurately to the people. Indeed, many if not most times they have been discouraged from doing so. He tried to help ones see this but to no avail. “My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge.” ~ (Hosea 4:6). The foundational truths of: God the Father, Jesus Christ; the Holy Spirit, the Word of God, Mankind, Salvation, The Church, The Return of Christ ~ are not being taught properly in most cases, especially with depth and accuracy. I remember at a meeting once when a group of leaders and wives were there and this one pastor claimed that in order to grow we need to go back to our roots and just be enthusiastic like in the old campus days, I quoted John 6:63 “ It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing; the words that I have spoken to you are spirit and are life.” ~ I said something like: “we need more of the Word so the Spirit can use it to give life!” ~ he did not look pleased. Of course there were other tense moments, cold shoulders at Christmas parties, ones who didn’t know what was really going on saying the leaders just needed to get along... I remember praying fervently for God to open the others eyes. Also I asked God to help me be loving and kind to ones when I saw them. I was amazed how God did give me grace to genuinely love and tell ones that I was praying for the situation and them. One day my husband came home and told me that one pastor said to him that he was not humble. I was so upset and amazed because, while no one is perfect, he was and is very humble, he had been very patient through all this and had served faithfully for many, many years and only wanted to follow God and His Word. But once you disagree as a result of growing in your understanding of God’s Word, then you are the problem, you are messing up the unity, you are not humble. Again it’s their definition of humility ~ humble and submissive to them, apart from what God’s Word actually says. I went out that night to cool off and went to the mall and bought my husband some after shave called “Escape”! It’s nice that God gives us a sense of humor even at a time like that! Soon it was clear that someone needed to go and it was told it would be us. We began to search out possible places to go.
There’s a lot more I could say about the past but my main reason for writing this is so you could know you’re not alone, and for you to hear how God has indeed worked everything out for good (Romans 8:28) and has blessed us because of my husband’s faithfulness to the Lord and His Word! (Isaiah 66:2b; Matthew 16:18b). We moved far away and started all over. One very dear couple left our old church and moved here shortly after we did, to serve God with us. They have been a constant source of encouragement to us! We also are with some other dear people who have been involved in GC in the past but now all of us no longer are. The group here was very small when we arrived but they really wanted to learn the Bible as they also had been down the “seeker service” path and were also disenchanted with it. Our church is sweet and loving and growing in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus. We are all growing in faith, hope and love! Here’s a little “snap-shot”of us, although each healthy church will have different out-workings according to the God-given gifts of the local body there: We have a mix of all races (many countries are represented) and all ages: from newborn babies to 95! We also have some new people ~ ones who are truly interested in learning and living to please our gracious God. We have a very simple but God-honoring worship service on Sundays: prayer, singing, Scripture reading, then the preaching of the Word (my husband is going through Luke right now), prayer, singing, benediction (usually one of the sweet benedictions by Paul in the epistles or something similar) , and a spontaneous time of real fellowship follows in a nearby room. People hang out for a long time every Sunday. It is common to find ones talking with one another or guests about God and His Word. We have one or two guitarists and a small group of singers to teach and lead the songs. We sing a mix of the old Scripture songs, classic hymns, and only the best and most edifying of any modern songs. Our congregation is warm, friendly, and genuinely loving. We have communion once a month on Sunday mornings, there is a potluck lunch once a month; we have Sunday school classes for children under 12 and a nursery. There are various small group opportunities available during the weekdays. No one is required to go to anything. We have prayer meetings a least once a month. Several outreach events take place at different times of the year (not Sunday mornings ~ that is reserved for worshiping God!). New people do come to visit on Sundays and we encourage that ~ we just don’t change anything ~ they can observe us as we worship the God we love, and we love them and pray God’s Word will do some work in their heart! We go to nursing homes to sing, ones minister in the community as they desire. There is simply no pressure to do particular duties ~ it all flows out of a genuine, heartfelt and growing love for the Lord and His people. We have shared in each others’ joys in baptisms, weddings, birthdays, anniversaries, graduations; and each others’ sorrows in sicknesses, hospital stays, funerals. We are all just thankful to be going through life together, properly grounded by God’s Holy Word!
My husband and his present co-pastor went to many GC pastors’ conferences in the past. He said that in all the many years he went to GC pastors’ conferences, the continual emphasis was always on evangelism and relationships ~ he said that there was never even one GC pastors’ conference dedicated to training and encouraging pastors how to faithfully teach the Bible in order to feed the believers. Remember, most in GC, including leaders, have never heard much, if any, deep, accurate, and thorough Bible teaching themselves. You were told to be careful not to listen to others outside, especially ones who spoke with strong convictions on the Word. You can’t teach what you do not know, understand, believe, and have convictions on. Shortly before we left our old church we found that there was an excellent Bible training center for pastors near our new home. My husband and his co-pastor went there together in our early years here. Now they regularly go to a great pastors’ conference where excellent teachers of the Word encourage and exhort the all the men to properly teach the Bible, and offer many other “meaty” seminars in smaller group settings to help them in their ministry! He has been steadily teaching through books of the Bible and the foundational truths I listed above since we left. He spent at least a year on the foundations; then 3+ years on Ephesians (yes, verse by verse); some other expository sermons interspersed now and then; & he’s been in Luke for few years now. Both of our pastors also lovingly, sincerely, & faithfully care for all the people. They visit and call the older & sick ones just to see how they are doing and encourage them. They are personable, friendly, and caring to all. Truth and love! (Ps. 40:8-11) Some have said that these are the best pastors they have ever had!
As for me, I am most thankful that I can now sit under God-honoring, Christ-exalting, solid Biblical teaching every week! I am also thankful for the new friends God has given me. The co-pastors wife is a gem, loves to learn, and desires everything for God’s glory too! About a year ago God providentially led me to a pastor’s wife far away (not GC), whom I have never met but with whom I have spoken many times now, and who has gone through a similar situation. I have been privileged to comfort her with the comfort I have received from others. Also God led me to start a library for our church with many good books (and some tapes and cds) from only the best Christian writers and teachers! One of the charges that are made against ones like us is that “knowledge puffs up”. Actually, the better you know God through His Word and His workings in your life the more you realize you are nothing without Him! Everything good is by His grace alone! (Romans 11:36; James 1:17-18; 2 Cor. 4:5-7; 2 Cor. 9:8). They say that if we spend too much time reading and learning doctrine then we won’t evangelize. In reality just the opposite is true ~ we are more zealous than ever to witness to the lost because we know that God indeed has ones out there that He chose and put in His book of life long ago before the foundation of the world, for His good pleasure! ~ (Eph. 1:4-5; Acts 13:48; Romans 8:28-30; John 6:37-40 & 44-45; John 6:65; Col. 3:12; John 1:12-13). So we now have a place to bring ones to grow! Rather than letting ones continue to be children tossed to and fro by every wind of doctrine we speak the truth in love and encourage ones to “grow up in all aspects into Him” (Eph. 4:15) ...and to “Grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To Him be the glory, both now and to the day of eternity. Amen.” ~ (2 Peter 3:18). God’s Word is truly the most important thing in the universe, for only by the Word of God applied to people’s hearts by the power of the Spirit can they be saved and sanctified! ~ (2 Cor. 3:18; John 17:17; 2 Peter 1:2-3). “Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God.” (Matt. 4:4) It is where God reveals all that we need to know for spiritual life and godliness. And it is sufficient for every believer ~ to grow in love, wisdom, understanding, discernment, holiness... (Psalm 19:7-11 and Psalm 119; Phil.1:9-11). We are still in touch with many dear former GC people and many have moved on to better churches. Of course no church is perfect, but the most important thing to look for is how they handle the Word of God, for from that everything else flows!
Below is a list of just some of our favorite resources if you are interested in what has helped us in many ways. I will continue to keep you in my prayers. May God bless, lead, encourage, and protect each of you ~ for His greatest glory and greatest good of all His people!
~ In our Lord Jesus’ love, for His glory! ~ Truth Lover
www.biblebb.com Excellent Bible teaching here! Click on “Looking for a good church?” for a state by state list of good Bible teaching churches ~ some countries too! Also excellent are the “Grace Gems”~click on “Join our free e-mailing list”. We read them every day!
www.sfpulpit.com Excellent, “meaty” articles from gifted pastors! You can sign up to have these e-mailed to you daily! We read these every day too!
www.gty.org Very excellent Bible teaching books, cds...Thorough, accurate teaching by a great pastor and teacher, to edify and nourish!
www.awordfromtheword.com More excellent Bible teaching, books, cds by another gifted Bible teacher and former pastor!
www.zionshope.org/zionsfire Excellent, well written articles on prophecy & Israel by a very gifted Bible teacher. The site is being renovated & soon will be done. You can sign up for a free subscription to the 1st class magazine, Zion’s Fire!
