Welcome to De-Commissioned, a place for former members of the Great Commission movement (aka GCM, GCC, GCAC, GCI, the Blitz) to discuss problems they've experienced in the association's practices and theology.

You may read and post, but some features are restricted to registered members. Please consider registering to gain full access! Registration is free and only takes a few moments to complete.
De-Commissioned Forum
November 27, 2022, 12:05:42 pm *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
 
  Home   Forum   Help Search Login Register  
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 [9]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: What if MD is found to NOT be....  (Read 151472 times)
Free now
Regular (15-99 Posts)
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 29



« Reply #160 on: March 28, 2018, 07:42:10 pm »

Mapleleaf, I could appreciate what you were trying to express.
Logged
Heidi
Regular (15-99 Posts)
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 49



« Reply #161 on: March 28, 2018, 08:11:20 pm »

MapleLeaf-

I agree with your post and statements.  The our spiritual journey and walk with Jesus are not black and white.

Jeromy- Your responses are genuinely troubling to me also. 
Heidi





Logged
araignee19
Veteran (100-299 Posts)
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 278



« Reply #162 on: March 28, 2018, 08:17:47 pm »

Mapleleaf, I think I appreciate the sentiment of your post, and think it was a gracious thing to say and you seem to have a caring heart. Thank you.

However, I'll propose a slightly different take on your idea. I do think the world is black and white, but we humans don't have good enough vision to see it, and to us it looks grey. So we should be careful to call something black or white if it is not specifically spelled out in the Bible. We should offer grace over judgment because we humbly accept we are not all knowing like God is.

I also think some of the greatest people in the Bible are clear examples of how we can do good things and bad things, but still be a "man after God's own heart." Think of King David. Great man, and one of the best examples we have of following God. Yet he had an affair with a married woman and covered it up by having the husband killed. Even if Mark Darling did these things he is accused of, I truly agree it does not invalidate the good he has done. And the reason is that ultimately, Mark, you, myself, all of us are dirty rotten sinners to the core. We don't get the credit for any of the good we have done. God does. So how silly that we think we could undo all of God's good works by our own sin!

Isn't this the whole point of Christianity?
« Last Edit: March 28, 2018, 08:47:41 pm by araignee19 » Logged
Linda
Household Name (300+ Posts)
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2510



« Reply #163 on: March 29, 2018, 04:35:16 am »

Quote from: Jeromy
They do not exist in the same person.

I think they can exist in the same person.

“If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?” —Solzhenitsyn
« Last Edit: March 29, 2018, 05:10:09 am by Linda » Logged

Thanks be unto God for his unspeakable gift.
HughHoney
Guest

« Reply #164 on: March 29, 2018, 08:13:00 am »

“For the Son of Man came abstaining from eating and drinking, preaching the Kingdom of Black and White, and whoever calls on his name their souls shall ascend to heaven when they die, meanwhile submit as the gentiles do to their great men who exercise their authority.”
Logged
Rebel in a Good Way
Private Forum Access
Household Name (300+ Posts)
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 455



« Reply #165 on: March 31, 2018, 12:08:20 pm »

Jumping in here after traveling.  I think the desire to keep the board members secret so they are not contacted by outside people is right in line with the us vs. them mentality that GCx has been long accused of having.  It's part of information, thought, and emotional control. 

It also deflects from the investigation to get people thinking about those "outsiders" and what their intentions might be.

https://freedomofmind.com/bite-model/
Logged
Huldah
Private Forum Access
Household Name (300+ Posts)
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1006



« Reply #166 on: March 31, 2018, 02:49:11 pm »

Good grief, Rebel, when I started reading through the part on Behavior Control, I was ticking off the list one by one, "Yes, they did that; yes, they did that one, too; and that one; and that one..." Right down the list.
Logged
Rebel in a Good Way
Private Forum Access
Household Name (300+ Posts)
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 455



« Reply #167 on: April 06, 2018, 07:12:54 am »

Huldah, I agree that many are check-off-able, from both personal experience and according to their current written documentation.

But teaching fear of "outsiders," as in cancelling the meeting they were going to hold, and withholding the names of board members, definitely touches on all the BITE categories.

It's interesting, in regards to the other thread about ECFA, that part of ECFA's requirements are TRANSPARENCY.  So all of this information is supposed to be made available, although it might need to be requested in writing. I'm guessing the IRS also has some standards in place.  Perhaps Joan Harris was able to advise the Evergreen Board on their rights in this situation when she wasn't doing her "independent" investigation  Wink
Logged
Neville Longbottom
Obscure Poster (1-14 Posts)
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 5



« Reply #168 on: April 06, 2018, 01:19:37 pm »

I was a previous BOT member at a GC church. I, along with three others, were hand-selected by the pastors. In a board meeting we were told by three pastors that the board was strictly financial and the pastors were accountable to each other. All other decisions about the church would be made by the pastors and no one else.

Note: none of the board members I served with had any background in finance at that time. (Three of us were in the inner circle, those who had paid our dues and shown our loyalty for years. It was no surprise the three of us were selected.) Also, one of the board members tried to insist that the pastor be given two votes because "he was the pastor."

It is puzzling to me that the ECBOT would be selected to make a determination regarding what happens in this situation.

1) They are a financial board.
2) I would hope that with as many people as Evergreen pastors had to choose from that they chose board members with financial backgrounds or credentials. If this is true, what qualifies them for such a decision as this?
3) The anonymity of the members to those in EC and outside EC makes me question what is being hidden. Are the board members related to anyone involved? Are they employed by the church? Are they looking to be raised up as a pastor?
Logged
UffDa
Regular (15-99 Posts)
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 46



« Reply #169 on: April 07, 2018, 08:26:03 pm »

Neville Longbottom,
When you were on the ECC BOT did you ever sign or file anything with the state of MN?
Were they BOT meetings ever announced to the church?
Were the meetings open for church members to attend?
Logged
GodisFaithful
Private Forum Access
Household Name (300+ Posts)
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 328



« Reply #170 on: April 08, 2018, 10:37:41 am »

Looks like Neville was a BOT member at a GC church but not Evergreen.

His experience will be interesting, though, regardless. Hope he comes back on.
Logged
Rebel in a Good Way
Private Forum Access
Household Name (300+ Posts)
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 455



« Reply #171 on: April 08, 2018, 11:30:07 am »

I am not sure where GTA got the information that Joan Harris is a U of M law professor, but she is not listed anywhere on U of M Law School's website, nor is being a professor listed on her own resume.  And I do not see anywhere that she teaches ethics.

Where did you get this information, GTA?

https://www.law.umn.edu/our-faculty

https://ogletree.com/people/joan-e-h-harris

Also, looking at her current position, it emphasizes that she works on the MANAGEMENT side of employment.

These are the speeches listed on her resume, the first one is particularly interesting. 

Ogletree Deakins Briefing - ''Beer, Wine, and Spirits, Part II: Strategies for Reducing Risk When Dealing with Sensitive, Uncomfortable, and Awkward Situations with Employees'' - Stillwater - July 10, 2017
National Employment Law Council Annual Conference -

''Crisis Management for the Employment Practitioner'' - Chicago - April 2015

National Employment Law Council Annual Conference - ''Impact of Blogs/Personal Websites in the Workplace/Internal Investigations'' - Atlanta - May 2008




ECC Board of Trustees hired an independent 3rd party investigative lawyer (which they did not need to do), Joan Harris.  She performs independent 3rd party investigations for organizations.  This is her job, this is what she does.  She is also a U of M Law professor, and teaches on ethics, and has very positive reviews as a professor (she sounds just terrible, right?!).  We currently do not know if the BOT will make the results transparent or not, currently they suggested they do not plan to as they are bound by some employment laws. 

I would suggest that everyone be patient and wait to see how this plays out before continuing on with grandiose ideas and speculations that are fed by your previously held prejudices towards GCx churches and it's leaders. 
Logged
UffDa
Regular (15-99 Posts)
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 46



« Reply #172 on: April 08, 2018, 05:18:15 pm »

Joan E Harris is an Adjunct Professor at the University of St. Thomas.
https://www.stthomas.edu/law/facultystaff/a-z-index/joan-harris.html
Logged
Rebel in a Good Way
Private Forum Access
Household Name (300+ Posts)
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 455



« Reply #173 on: April 08, 2018, 05:47:09 pm »

UffDa, thanks for that clarification.  I am surprised it is not on her work bio but that clears things up.  Maybe she has taught ethics in the past?  Now it looks like employment law. 
Logged
Herpes_free_since03
Obscure Poster (1-14 Posts)
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1



« Reply #174 on: April 10, 2018, 04:04:51 am »

I love reading this website. I’ve moved on from GCM about 10 years ago. I was only in it for about 1.5 years (thank God) and I can honestly say I was so close to leaving my faith afterwards. Anyways, these accusations don’t surprise me at all. They are completely in line with a serial attention seeker. I doubt MD ever intended to sexually abuse anyone (I don’t see any evidence  of that happening anywhere) BUT I think he was severely inappropriate, if the accusations are accurate. Seems that many people have claims of similar situations so  shouldnt we all assume they are at least 50% true? My opinion, that makes sense right? If i have a few people that all have similar accusations, most would believe them, based solely on familiarity. Also, let me say that this behavior does not surprise me when considering MDs personality - and what the hell is up with the leather jackets? Weird. Arrogance hidden in false humility is what I saw from faith walkers the one time i went, THANK GOD. That being said, that behavior is supporting if someone who would seek attention from women in the manner accused.
As to the manner in which the investigation is heading: who cares. The people who love MD will always love him and he will probably have the same influence forthcoming. However he probably won’t use women for his own affirmation anymore. And the people who think he probably is a little creepy with his strange need for learning of others sex lives, inappropriatel relationships with girls in the past, will continue to not respect him or ECC. Move on. As long as the Whitney’s and the Darlings are around, the weird cultish environment will proceed. I’d encourage everyone to go to a healthy church and not look back. Unless you’re looking back to see Jeromy Darlings whining posts - LOVE THEM. Very similar to his whiny songs i used to love. No offense to Jeromy, he is pretty cool for a home schooled kid turned famous to 3,000 people. Anyways, please keep posting everyone, I like to read the posts to remind me of why GCM is a borderline cult.

Logged
Digital Lynch Mob
Veteran (100-299 Posts)
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 238



« Reply #175 on: April 10, 2018, 03:09:24 pm »

Your name tells me all I need to know about you.
Logged
UffDa
Regular (15-99 Posts)
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 46



« Reply #176 on: April 10, 2018, 08:05:53 pm »

I guess the same could be said about you too, DLM.
Logged
Neville Longbottom
Obscure Poster (1-14 Posts)
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 5



« Reply #177 on: April 11, 2018, 12:50:35 pm »

I was on a GC board, but not at EC. Our meetings were never listed in the bulletin, agendas and minutes were not publicly posted, and members of the church were not invited to attend. It was largely a rubber stamp for whatever the pastors wanted. I resigned after 6 months; I was always the dissenting vote. I found that my standards of accountability were higher than the board's, and it was too conflicting and frustrating to attend each meeting. I also disagreed with having board meeting at local restaurants - food and drinks provided by the tithing base of our church.
Logged
puff of purple smoke
Administrator
Household Name (300+ Posts)
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 604



« Reply #178 on: July 10, 2018, 07:56:24 am »

It was pointed out to me that the Nixonian list of names that started this thread violates forum rules, and so the last names have been edited out of the initial post and follow-up posts that quote it.
Logged
Linda
Household Name (300+ Posts)
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2510



« Reply #179 on: July 10, 2018, 08:13:45 am »

Thank you, Puff.
Logged

Thanks be unto God for his unspeakable gift.
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 [9]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  


Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC
SimplePortal 2.1.1