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Author Topic: Believe it or not, Jim McCotter is back - sort of!  (Read 39519 times)
distant thunder
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« on: January 02, 2013, 11:48:25 am »

(I was involved in the Blitz Movement of the 70s and then into the 80s until McCotter left - left the church and left others to lie about the real reasons he was leaving i.e. the leaders had rejected his apostleship revelation and he had just inherited a fortune from his in-laws.)

Every year or so, I do a random search for Jim McCotter in an effort to see if anything new is available. For the past 5 years or so, little news has been forthcoming. The previous 25 years are rather well known to most of us, including radio, television, and newspaper purchases both here and in New Zealand, as well as acquisitions of resort properties in Wyoming. In each and every case, these business ventures ended in failure, lawsuits, and out of court settlements with creditors, partners, and/or employees. His last business interest was as owner/ceo of Maverick Jets. And though that company still appears to be in business, Jim McCotter's name is no longer associated with the website or on the business license at the local chamber of commerce in Melbourne, Florida.

Last week's search produced some interesting fruit. McCotter now has a website and on it displays family pictures, as well as a photo of himself, Barb (his wife - almost unrecognizable to those of us who knew her 40 years ago), and Rick Santorum - presumably at some point during this past election campaign. Pictures of the inside of his home portray comfortable living quarters but nothing comparable to the million dollar range homes he had in Florida, New Zealand, and Wyoming.

But then the motherlode.....

I did a search for McCotter on YouTube and found a number of short teaching videos done in the past 4 months or so, as well as videos in which McCotter is shown as part of a group called Greenwood Fellowship. So, queue up Greenwood Fellowship....

The Greenwood Fellowship site states that they are part of a house church group that has churches in 25 cities in 3 different countries and that all these churches were begun in the past 12 months. Though a leadership list is conspicuously missing, there are a number of e books for sale, all bearing the initials JDM (James Douglas McCotter). The 'movement' is clearly in it's early stages but one thing is very clear - McCotter is making another run. What is less clear is why and why now.

Back to YouTube, I did another search for McCotter and this time found his own channel in which is one video.  In this video (made on 12/26/12 according to him), Jim is seated at a desk in a very cramped room and makes the promise that he is beginning a daily schedule of teachings on a variety of subjects and they will be broadcast by...and I kid you not....JimLiveTV.

Here are a few relevant links

jimmccotter.com

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PqJZHPNxRE

http://greenwoodfellowship.com/

A few pieces of information can be ascertained from perusing the above links.

1) The house in which Jim now lives is small and nothing in the same range as 10 years ago.
2) The furniture he owns has some signs of wear, hardly a sign of opulence.
3) The bulk of his family is missing from mention  -  odd for someone always surrounded by family.
4) He's clearly trying to rebuild a start up ministry - or start up scheme.
5) Several wine glasses can be seen in the house, evidently contradicting his previous stated belief in abstinence.

When I left in 1987, the rumor was that 'Jim is now worth $20 million'. No one really believed that. But if you look at all the purchased properties and businesses, as well as the cost of those failures including lawsuits and settlements, it isn't a stretch to believe that he once had access to a large sum of money and that it has all but dried up. Certainly his present living conditions do not suggest a life of luxury.

One more thing. I did an address search for McCotter and Roland Ripamonti. Apparently, they both live at the same address in Englewood, Co. and in a home that appraises for $160,000.

How have the 'mighty' fallen in battle!
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EverAStudent
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« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2013, 02:25:54 pm »

Personally, I take no joy in the fact McCotter has squandered his millions.  Also, I do not think a $160,000 house is anything too shabby (I live in a less expensive one than that).  

It does cause me immense grief and concern that he has apparently begun heading up a new "church movement" since he has never gone on record as admitting his doctrinal sins nor repenting of the incredible harm he did to so many hundreds (thousands?) of Christians.  

All I can do is offer my opinion--

To all who are becoming involved in a Jim McCotter church:  In my opinion his doctrine has always been very bad and he has an apparent track record of extreme authoritarianism that leaves lives shattered behind him.  I would advise you to leave while your conscience and your discernment will still allow it; you will not miss out on a movement of God so much as you may avoid becoming ensnared in an elitist movement that extolls itself.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2013, 02:28:57 pm by EverAStudent » Logged
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« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2013, 02:40:40 pm »

Arghhhhh!!!!!  

Jim McCotter has an entire set of web commercials on YouTube promoting his old doctrinally flawed books!  Even worse, one of the commercials promotes the Apostles and Prophets Leadership Manual which has been so convincingly shown to be heretical, misusing as it does so very many passages of Scripture ( http://thefaithfulword.org/apostlepageone.html ).

On the Greenwood Fellowship website (http://greenwoodfellowship.com/) McCotter has a list of the books he is selling (only $12.95 for the Leadership Manual!), but his name as author is obscured by the fact he only uses his initials (JDM).  Also, it mentions a book called Christian Nation Now that he says is written under a pen name (does the pen name belong to him?), Patrick Henry, which he says is going to sell for $49.95, and can be obtained by writing to Jim (why write to Jim McCotter to get the book, why not write to Patrick Henry?). 

One of my fears is that his old fondness of hiding behind a plethora of alias names (one name for the church, a separate name for the "student group" which is actually just the church, a different name for the "global fellowship," and yet another name for the leadership team, etc) just may continue, which in my opinion, is a means of deception and not in conformance with the scriptural requirement to be totally honest.

Jim is not just back "sort of," he really seems to be back teaching exactly the same stuff and using the same practices that brought so many of us to our spiritual valleys.  May God intervene.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2013, 03:50:55 pm by EverAStudent » Logged
Linda
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« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2013, 04:19:50 pm »

Fascinating!

This house church thing is interesting. Isn't Rick Whitney heavily involved in the "house church" thing in Kansas? Wonder if he will get on board with this program!

Adorable baby, though!
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Linda
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« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2013, 06:07:26 pm »

The Rock, Minneapolis has been big on the house church thing for a few years.

http://www.rockthechurch.com/main/house_church

Vintage Faith, Rich Whitney's church in Kansas is all about the house church.

http://www.vintagefaithchurch.cc/#/when-where-what

How interesting that the 2011 Pastor's and Leader's conference featured a seminar on reaching the next generation through house churches.

http://www.gccweb.org/podcasts/episode-1411/house-church.mp3

And, just last February, neverbeengcm posted this right here on the Forum.

http://forum.gcmwarning.com/general-discussion/great-commission-pastor's-conference-house-churches/

I just love a good conspiracy theory! Don't you. Perhaps Jim never left. It will be interesting to see how many of these GCC house churches join the "House Churches Network" and band together under a new name with JDM as their leader.

And, it makes me wonder about Summitview Loveland. Do you think they are joining "Jim's" new house church network. Stay tuned.
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« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2013, 06:24:49 pm »

Hmmmm.  Great sleuthing!  Really nice.  As an avid googler, I have to say I'm impressed. 

Now that said, I don't know what to think.  I really don't.
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« Reply #6 on: January 03, 2013, 11:14:31 am »

distant thunder,
Thank you so much for your research and helpful/informative comments.

It will be interesting to see how this all plays out. Hopler, etc. have done so much to try to distance themselves from McCotter (comments on the GCC site about how those posting here are talking about old GC, not current GC, etc.) that I don't see how any GC church could affiliate with him, but I do wonder if that is the plan. I think some of the "old school" guys never stopped following him.
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« Reply #7 on: January 03, 2013, 04:26:45 pm »

I was involved in the Blitz Movement of the 70s and then into the 80s until McCotter left - left the church and left others to lie about the real reasons he was leaving i.e. the leaders had rejected his apostleship revelation and he had just inherited a fortune from his in-laws.

Having taken some time to seriously think through the above opinion about why McCotter left, I have come to see that it does not match up with the facts very well.  

1) For some long time prior to rolling out the formal apostleship doctrine the national elders were already teaching that every man should be attempting to become pastors/elders,
2) The national elders, including Dennis Clark (whose name as co-author is also on the original book), read the pre-published manuscript, approved the manuscript, and offered up editing comments, demonstrating they knew about the doctrinal content well in advance of it being delivered to the GC churches,
3) The national elders helped McCotter construct the content of the “spiritual gifts” conference during  which he introduced both the doctrine and the book to the gathered GC churches,
4) The national elders arranged, organized, marketed, and attended the “spiritual gifts” conference,
5) The national elders published McCotter’s book, “Leadership: Elders and Apostles,” under their own Great Commission Books publishing label several months AFTER the “spiritual gifts” conference,
6) During the “spiritual gifts” conference not one elder or national elder stood up to object to the aberrant theology being presented,
7) After the “spiritual gifts” conference all the GC elders in all the GC churches distributed the so-called “Leadership Manual” to their individual congregations with the encouragement of the national elders--no one went on record to object to the poor theology,
8 ) When McCotter mysteriously left there was not one announcement by even one GC elder that McCotter had been confronted or reproached for having taught wrong doctrine regarding apostles,
9) After McCotter left Dennis Clark remained in good standing even though he co-authored the apostles book / leadership manual and never repudiated its heretical theology.

No, I am sorry.  There is nothing in the known history of that time that indicates the national elders were upset with the theology of the apostles teaching as delivered by McCotter.  

Perhaps an alternate guess?  Perhaps, just maybe, it was the practical implementation of the book that created conflict?  Specifically, consider this possible chain of events:
a) what if McCotter decides to instruct the local churches to give 10% of their collected offerings to “apostles,”
b) McCotter is the only recognized “apostle” in the GC denomination,
c) if every church only collected $20,000 annually in offerings (some would collect less, others much more), and if there were 160 churches in the GC denomination at that time, then McCotter could well expect the combined local churches to set aside 10% and send him $320,000 annually as their tithe to the “apostle.”  

Could it be that it was not the theology of apostles that bothered the national elders, but the insane amount of money they might suddenly owe to Jim?  Just asking the question.  I have no evidence of this, and it just represents my own guess.  But what I do know is that the GC national elders never expressed in public any disagreement with the doctrine and theology of apostles that they themselves had helped foist onto the denomination.  But I did hear GC elders behind the scenes comment that Jim had accrued too much money and power for himself.  Again, just a theory, just an opinion.

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« Reply #8 on: January 03, 2013, 04:40:43 pm »

Quote from: EAS
But what I do know is that the GC national elders never expressed in public any disagreement with the doctrine and theology of apostles that they themselves had helped foist onto the denomination.
I think this is the most troubling aspect of the history. To date, GC has not corrected the bad teaching.
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« Reply #9 on: January 04, 2013, 02:02:39 pm »


A few pieces of information can be ascertained from perusing the above links.

1) The house in which Jim now lives is small and nothing in the same range as 10 years ago.
2) The furniture he owns has some signs of wear, hardly a sign of opulence.
3) The bulk of his family is missing from mention  -  odd for someone always surrounded by family.
4) He's clearly trying to rebuild a start up ministry - or start up scheme.
5) Several wine glasses can be seen in the house, evidently contradicting his previous stated belief in abstinence.

When I left in 1987, the rumor was that 'Jim is now worth $20 million'. No one really believed that. But if you look at all the purchased properties and businesses, as well as the cost of those failures including lawsuits and settlements, it isn't a stretch to believe that he once had access to a large sum of money and that it has all but dried up. Certainly his present living conditions do not suggest a life of luxury.

One more thing. I did an address search for McCotter and Roland Ripamonti. Apparently, they both live at the same address in Englewood, Co. and in a home that appraises for $160,000.

How have the 'mighty' fallen in battle!

I don't know about the house part -- I looked on Google maps for the address in the website (E. Fair Avenue), and it showed the entrance to a gated community.  There may still be money left!  What was the Englewood address that you found?

Somebody much better at writing than I am ought to consider going to the Wikipedia article about Jim McCotter and adding this new information.  It could be very interesting to anyone looking to find out more about him -- especially somebody in Colorado that he's trying to influence.
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« Reply #10 on: January 04, 2013, 08:17:31 pm »

Should a Christian Tithe? By Jim McCotter and a foreword by Dennis Clark, copyright 1982.  This fourteen page “book” sold for 85cents to the saints in the mid-1980’s, so it says on the cover page.  

In it McCotter wrote, “We are directed in the New Testament to give elders and apostles appropriate wages. … New Testament believers should tithe to the Lord by way of their local elders.  … All elders should tithe to the Lord by way of their apostles or national leaders.”

He clarifies his use of the word apostle:  “For the purpose of New Testament identification we use the Greek word ‘apostle.‘ … However, today, president, board, headquarters or some other name usually identifies those carrying national leadership with a group.”

The “book” also contains two diagrams showing the churches “giving 10% and free-will offerings” to the elders who then give ten percent of that to the “apostles” who then give a tithe to the Lord.  

At the end of the “book” is a “commitment” for the saints to literally sign which is nothing less than a prayer / vow to God to “regularly tithe (10%) of all I receive when I first receive it…I will immediately separate it for Yourself…Thank You dear Lord…In the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ…”

Was McCotter seeking overly much power and overly much control of GC's denominational funds?  He writes, "All giving by believers in the Old and New Testaments was channeled through their leaders. ... The church fund, then, should consist of the tithes as well as the free-will offerings [and] from this total church fund the leaders should direct the money."

So, once again I note that the “national leaders” (McCotter calls them “apostles” in this tiny book) never went on record to object to his theology of apostleship--they even promoted it.  So was it that they objected to having to tithe directly to McCotter as their apostle that finally pushed them over the top?  It is a question worth asking.

---

Update.  I should have quoted a line or two from McCotter's own Introduction:
"This may be the most important message you have ever heard since receiving Jesus Christ.  It may make the difference in your experiencing a greater power of the Holy Spirit than you ever knew about and being truly wealthy forever.  ... this subject is one major water lock that has prevented the church from reaching the whole world with the gospel ... even more important than the subjects of prayer, commitment, evangelism, or holiness..."

 
« Last Edit: January 04, 2013, 09:01:17 pm by EverAStudent » Logged
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« Reply #11 on: January 04, 2013, 08:39:40 pm »

EAS, Interesting. Do you have all the old books and booklets?

When I read the Leadership Book (ugh, what a horrible read that was) a few things jumped out at me. One of them was this little tidbit in the Apostles section:

Quote from: McCotter
Nonetheless, the apostles’ financial support should not stop when they leave a church, any more than physical children should stop honoring their parents and grandparents by sharing with them (1 Timothy 5:4). Paul does not indicate that financial support should stop, even years later and countries away. The church in Philippi is one example of this. Dr. Dwight Pentecost writes, "When the Philippians had joined with other Macedonians in giving the first gift to the apostle Paul, they did not adopt the attitude, now we have discharged our obligation — that’s the end of it. They recognized their obligation to the apostle as a continuing obligation because of the sacrifice that Paul had endured to bring the gospel to them."

I always wondered if this meant that McCotter continued to collect a share after he left. Years later and countries away.

No one would ever know since there is no meaningful financial accountability.

Of course, the other huge thing that gets passed right over by many is the idea that the leaders at the beginning of GC were all self-appointed apostles and elders. No one seems to care about that.
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« Reply #12 on: January 05, 2013, 02:56:41 am »

Rather than hijack the original point of this thread, I have started a new thread in the dead horses folder, probably where it belongs.  The topic is whether the National Elders actually kicked out McCotter for heresy and lied to everyone by saying they did not.  

The original post in the new thread has a timeline which demonstrates that the National Elders taught the apostleship polity heresy from 1982 until 1986 along with McCotter and Clark.  No one from the National Elders Team has ever repented in public of the sin of teaching the apostleship heresy OR for lying to us all about why McCotter left.  

If someone claims to have been a National Elder from 1982 to 1986 it seems to us they owe us one or both apologies.

New thread: http://forum.gcmwarning.com/the-moribund-equine/timeline-for-mccotters-departure-why-did-he-leave/msg11999/?topicseen#msg11999

Update:
By the way, this is not a secret topic or a secret thread on the dead horse folder, but I did notice that you can only access it if you are logged on with your forum account, so "visitors" who have not logged on will not be able to read or comment.  That was not intentional, but I am not inclined to move the thread, so if it interests you, log on and access it if you want.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2013, 02:59:24 pm by EverAStudent » Logged
askingquestionsaboutGCI
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« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2013, 11:19:25 am »

askingquestionsaboutGCI.....

The residence that I found for Jim is not the home on E. Fair (which is listed on the Greenwood Village site and appears to be for business purposes). I am hesitant to mention the exact address I found for fear that, if something happened to that home or the residents within, I could be held culpable. If you go through Intelius or Spokeo, you'll find the address to which I refer. But I would advise you to be careful in posting it here. In the hands of the wrong person......


Totally agree.  I only mentioned the address above since it was publicly listed on the website.  My very brief searching hadn't turned up anything else; I'll follow your leads!!
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« Reply #14 on: January 05, 2013, 02:03:18 pm »

tempaussie, Interesting. And pathetic. Thanks.

I've been looking at some of the You Tube videos done last August that promote the books by JDM. This one is a hoot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGZyk4ruxjY

In it McCotter makes two points.

1. He seems to buy into Dominion Theology.

2. And this is the most fun one. Jim advocates anonymity!! He mentions that the 800 page book is written by "Patrick Henry", a person using a pseudonym and explains how the Founding Fathers used pseudonyms (not pseudo-names, btw Wink ) because their ideas were dangerous! I love it!
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« Reply #15 on: January 05, 2013, 08:56:09 pm »

Quote
At a conference in the very early 80s (either at York, Pa. or Jamestown, NY.), there was a young sister (probably 19 or 20) who developed a dental infection. Now what you do for a dental infection is to treat it with antibiotics and anti-inflammatories until a root canal can be performed. You especially do this with a young person because, well, who wants to begin life missing a tooth. The cost would have been minimal and I, upon hearing this, was in the process of taking up a collection for a dental visit and the requisite medication. However, her elders deemed that the subsequent cost would be too high and that such monies would be spent on the gospel. And so they took what money we raised, trecked her to a local dentist, and had the tooth pulled. She cried about the loss of the tooth for the remaining part of the conference. This was the first time I recognized an undercurrent of indifference to those who were not 'stars' in the fellowship. I will also add here that McCotter spoke at this conference (the subject was Philippians) and had developed a cold for which he received somewhere in the neighborhood of 20 cold remedies (he paraded them in front of the audience) from concerned saints.



I don't know why this disturbs me as much as it does, but for some reason I find this to be one of the more disturbing things we've ever discussed about GCx.  I think it's so disturbing because it's taking someone's beauty away and for such a pittance of money saved in the long run.  That poor girl.  I'm sure it wasn't a tooth in the front, hopefully they would never do something that horrible, but it's just so controlling.  It's so abusive and absolutely disgusting that they would force someone to do that.  And you KNOW they would never have done this to a leader's wife, right?  Right?  Sad 
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« Reply #16 on: January 05, 2013, 09:42:23 pm »

And they didn't even give her a chance to call her parents to see if they would pay for the root canal, or whether she might still be eligible under their dental insurance?

That was so cruel. In fact, it doesn't sound like "immaturity" or "overzealousness" or an error in judgment or any of the other excuses the leadership always make. It sounds downright spiteful.

I wonder where she is and what she's doing today. I wonder if anyone ever apologized to her.

You know what I would love to hear? Now that those GC elders are older, they presumably have some savings or retirement investments. They could afford to make this right. I'd love to hear that someone from the leadership tried to track her down and offer to pay for, or reimburse her for, a replacement implant. That alone would go a long way toward showing me that they were taking responsibility for the damage they did in the past.

What an awful story.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2013, 09:56:50 pm by Huldah » Logged
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« Reply #17 on: January 05, 2013, 10:20:01 pm »

I too would love to hear how she's doing and if she's still with GCx.  Honestly, that's so awful, authoritarian, and controlling.  Young, idealistic kids should not be playing pastor and parenting adult children.  And for the "gospel". Ugh.
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« Reply #18 on: January 06, 2013, 08:57:33 am »

The tooth incident is so sad. I would be very angry if that was my daughter. Again, parents are left out of the loop. GC elders like to think of themselves as "spiritual parents" and insert themselves between parents and their children. It is so wrong. I, too, wonder what happened to this girl who has to live the rest of her life with a physical reminder of this horrible event.

Agatha, they may have done it to a leader's wife, but I'm positive they wouldn't have done it to a leader.
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« Reply #19 on: January 06, 2013, 01:32:22 pm »

Have you seen this one where he mentions "The Blitz" and talks about the "house churches" in the good old days? Then, he moves on to talking about house churches catching on here in the US (Darling, Whitney?), then he moves on to the house church movement in China. Do you think he it taking credit for the house church movement in China! Ha!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqeJR1rAvcQ
« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 08:45:41 pm by Linda » Logged

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